Restauration question #2 - water deflector hole/tube

feri

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Hello,

My second question is about the water deflector holes or tubes on the chassis. First off all please excuse my bad drawing, but i guess it can be seen on the first picture that it is an e9 :)
So far 4 tubes were found, two tubes (number 1 and 2 on the picture) are under the C pillar of the car, but we haven't found any hole on the door step.
The next two tubes (number 3 and 4 on the pictures) seems to be okay, there are holes where the tubes can be connected. They are on the floor of the boot.

My questions are:
- which holes are original ?
- what can we do with the tubes under the C pillar ? Were these tubes used to deflect the water (rain) to a hole (so we need to make holes into the chassis), or these tubes deflected the water into the door step directly?

If you have any factory / unrestored e9 picture about these parts of the car, then please post it to this topic, or send it to me : info@capabmw.hu

Thank you very much for your help in advance.

[Broken External Image]:http://www.capabmw.hu/e9forum/e9-drawn-1.jpg

[Broken External Image]:http://www.capabmw.hu/e9forum/waterhole1.jpg

[Broken External Image]:http://www.capabmw.hu/e9forum/waterhole2.jpg

[Broken External Image]:http://www.capabmw.hu/e9forum/waterhole3.jpg

[Broken External Image]:http://www.capabmw.hu/e9forum/waterhole4.jpg
 

velocewest

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Feri,
The tubes you show I assume are the drain tubes for the sunroof? (I am asuming because my car has no sunroof and it has no tubes...) I would take a lesson from Paul Cain, in his amazing resto-customization of a 3.0 into the the 3.8CSi.

Fabricate tubes that take the water completely through the bottom of the trunk floor and the rocker panels and out of the car body entirely. This will prevent this design flaw from starting the rust anew in your fresh restoration.

Cheers,
Tony
 

decoupe

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"I'm fixin' a hole where the rain is getting in"

You could get rid of the sunroof altogether, which is my plan in about 5 years. Never did see the logic of cutting holes in the roof and then trying to keep the rain out.

I would give good odds that the cars with the least amount of rust are typically those that don't have a sunroof (all else being equal). Less wind noise, too.

I might think differently in a drier climate but then I would still take A/C over the sunroof.
 

MichaelP

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Tony, you should have (or have had) tubes running from the air vent on the c-pillar into the foreward end of the rear arch (feri's first photo, I think). Both of the sunroofless 2800CSs that I've had have them.
 

velocewest

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Tony, you should have (or have had) tubes running from the air vent on the c-pillar into the foreward end of the rear arch (feri's first photo, I think). Both of the sunroofless 2800CSs that I've had have them.
The c-pillar drains could be there -- I haven't really looked. I was just guessin' based on my lack of a sunroof.
 

vraned

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As mentioned above, the forward vent tubes drain the C-pillar emblem, as shown below:
P6180005.jpg


These tubes seem to one of the (many) contributors to rear rocker corrosion. I poked a tube through the wheel well to avoid draining through the rockers entirely.

P6200010.jpg


This works fine for fixed rear windows. More careful placement would be required with electric rear windows.

I have only seen the rear tubes on sunroof cars.
 

feri

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Dear all,

Thank you for your answer. So if i understand correctly, the back (boot) tubes can be seen on sunroof cars, and the holes in the botton of the boot are correct, and the front tubes used for drainin water from the c pillar (from the bmw logo ?)

vraned:

Thank you for your excellent photos. So originally in your car the front (c pillar) tubes are not connected to any hole -> directly let the water goes into rocker panels without connected into any hole in the rocker panel ? Or if there is any hole in the rocker panel, where can i be seen ? I haven't seen any hole there.

Your solution looks great, unfortunately in my country it can't be used, because if you want to get correct papers for an oldtimer car, you have to restore it to 100% original.
 

MichaelP

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I can't speak to the matter of sunroof tubes, but you're correct that the c-pillar tubes (from the roundel badged vent) are drained into the fender adjacent to the subframe bushing with no exit for the water. That's why so many e9s have rusty rockers and gaping holes from the fender well to the subframe mount.

This was a serious and stupid design flaw on the part of Karmann and to duplicate their error will produce the same result (by definition, insanity). Once the car is restored and buttoned up, surely an exit hole as illustrated in the earlier post (or similar) would go unnoticed. Perhaps contacting Mobile Tradition and convincing someone to provide a letter backing up such an alteration wouldn't be impossible. It was Karmann's fault after all....
 

vraned

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Feri:

Yes the tube drains directly into the C-pillar where it meets the rear wheel well. It does not go through.

P7080033.jpg


Instead, drain vents are formed into the outer most layer of the rocker panel, as shown below, to allow accumulated water exit. These drains run along the bottom seam of the rocker, with an especially large drain provided in the C-pillar region. As many people on this site can attest, this design is not condusive to longevity.

P3190057.jpg
 
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