1968 2000 CS Bonhams

Were the Karmann body tags on the left lower A-pillar supposed to be painted over on these? I thought they were like E9's where the tag is black on sliver and installed after the body is painted.
 
Painted body tags

I agree John and for me that is part of the reason the price is so interesting.

Did anybody actually see the condition of this car?
 
Nash said:
I agree John and for me that is part of the reason the price is so interesting.

Did anybody actually see the condition of this car?
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Maybe a case of auction fever. Usually those who are selling restored cars are not the same folks as those who can do good restorations. One is a business for speculators who require the buyer to beware, and the other is one based on time, materials, and trust.
 
If you like this "trend" you don't see how ****ed up the hobby has become!
 
oh dear.

I have to defend what I see as a simple/innocent statement made by 'car snob" below. BTW, I have no idea who "car snob" is and have no affiliation to him/her.

I think its lovely our BMWs are now getting the recognition we all think they deserve and I also hope the trend continues.

At the risk of boring or upsetting some, many on this forum have bemoaned how our gorgeous coupes have been so left behind in the rise in value of other Classic cars. Our E9s are way behind, Porsches, Ferraris, Mercedes, many Alfas, mark one Escorts in Europe, even Volvo P1800s are making as much as a decent e9 these days.


I will try to address the comment about "our hobby" just simply from my viewpoint/opinion.

Yes, cars have risen in value and many that we all love are creeping away from our wallets and/or dreams. I am afraid, that is just natural evolution in nice things when there is money about and certainly money as cheap as it is today and as some might say as worthless as it is today. Yes, investors get involved, as they do in every other commodity, from the coffee you buy, to the Van Gogh painting majority of us can't afford.

I like to think, we have and have had an opportunity to purchases things we never would have when they were new, there is a period and with E9s its been a really long period, that we have to indulge ourselves in the stuff dreams are made of. That period eventually ends, normally when the world and his brother wakes up to how insightful you all were.

Money in the hobby, means more great cars saved. I hope most of us think E9s are great cars and if we own one, should be pleased they are starting to rise alongside some others.

If you don't own an E9 and are looking, the very best of luck to you. If you don't own one and feel they are now too expensive, I would just say we have to make our own choices and when demand starts outstripping supply, prices will rise, no matter what you, I or anybody else thinks or wants.

Just my opinions, I have no doubt others may feel very differently.
 
Ditto

Mixed feelings of course, but it the nature of the beast. These cars have been undervalued. Lucky for those who got in at the right time.

With the higher prices as Nash noted it will increase the number of cars being restored that would otherwise been left to rust to the ground. That has to be a good thing.
 
Oh....Nash, I just purchased a Volvo P1800ES. Another car I have alway wanted and it is now or never...
 
Like Nash and dp said I can see both sides. This is something the vintage Porsche guys obsess over and quite frankly they are usually the most boring threads usually with the flipper types commentating that don't look at the car so much for enjoyment driving, but rather to make money in the ever increasing market. To keep this simple and to the point, be careful what you wish for, it is a very slippery slope. You can get priced out of the cars you love with one minor fender bender. When NOS taillights cost $5K, (twice as much as my daily driver), it really makes you scratch your head and wonder if you really want to keep opening up your wallet, or shouldn't say want to, but can you? I'd rather have these stay affordable enough that repairs and upkeep won't kill the slightly above average Joe that likes to work on his own car. And I only say that because hey, these are still BMW's, c-mon....Best cars on the planet, forget that Italian trash. Who cares what they are worth really if you never intend to sell it and would rather pass the hobby and love on to your kids or nieces and nephews if you don't have kids. I'd give mine to my Lab but I don't think the neighbors would appreciate her cruising around the hood. She already poops and pees wherever she dam pleases....... Anyhow, enjoy what you have fellas, don't be obsessed with the prices, enjoy the ride. I'm actually hoping for a market "correction" that will bring boats and cars back down to reality again so that I can look for my next project......or two. Cheers! That is a beautiful M1 though...must be nice!
 
No disrespect to Volvo P1800ESs "Lotuss7" :oops:.

They are awesome looking cars and deserve the recognition as well. In fact, any old car somebody else loves is always good/great with me. But, its the hobby and the people we get to meet, I value so much.
 
I have been saying for decades I don't care if our cars appreciate. I could never have afforded one if they had been lusted after like so many other marques at the time. Carl Nelson just told me he sold his last Air Slide Valve for the d-jet on my coupe for $850. Terrific for Carl, but that prices me out of the market and sends me searching for alternatives.

My coupe will go to my daughter. But I will have to set up a small trust, hopefully, so she can afford to keep it in the style to which it has become accustomed. She could not afford it on her own. And she has a good job.

So wake up guys. There is a steep downside to these ascending auction prices. I suspect that a $50k profit one might clear on a coupe is not going to make a big difference in our lives or our estates.

I think I will call my insurance agent on Monday and up the agreed value again. So if something catastrophic happens I can buy a close replacement.
 
Hi oneils,

Its fantastic that you drive yours as you do, enjoy it to the fullest and will eventually hand it to your daughter, certainly that is a dream of many and I admire you for doing it so.

I absolutely agree, there is a down side and it is unfortunate that everybody can't be as lucky and or as exclusive/individual as E9 owners. In an ideal world they would be affordable to everybody forever.

Sadly - I hope I am saying this with respect, because that is my intentions - thats just not the way of the world and would we still want them if everybody had one? I don't know, but for me, the individuality is certainly a piece of the desire.

I truly believe the classic car market will have ups and downs, I don't know when the down might be, but I can guarantee it will happen. We are certainly seeing some softening of the fastest accelerating classics in the last 18 months. Mercedes 300SL's are no longer the $1.8m from last year, Porsche 911S's have slowed and only the great cars are bringing the big dollars, unlike last year where anything with an S on the end doubled, even BMWs great 507 is not commanding the $2.5m it once was, so it looks like a soft correction has started.

That said, our more "normal" BMWs have lagged so far behind the rest of the market, that they became an outlier or at least an anomaly in the classic car world and have now started to make up that gap.

So, while I hear and respect peoples opinion on the demise of everybody being able to play in this space. I feel (and its just my opinion) that not having the market do what it does would/could mean many things, but amongst them has to be less cars saved in good and caring way. We have had a very, very long time with our E9s to jump on the bandwagon, longer than almost every great coupe from a major manufacture with such outstanding race history, maybe when the downturn comes, all those who have waited can jump back in, in the short term.

Long term, I am afraid it will be a different matter, as it should for something so absolutely gorgeous.
 
Obimmer-care

"I absolutely agree, there is a down side and it is unfortunate that everybody can't be as lucky and or as exclusive/individual as E9 owners. In an ideal world they would be affordable to everybody forever."

If the white house steps in wealthy purchasers of E9s would be compelled to pay a $100,000 surcharge to keep the E9 affordable for all :shock:
 
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Stan said:
"I absolutely agree, there is a down side and it is unfortunate that everybody can't be as lucky and or as exclusive/individual as E9 owners. In an ideal world they would be affordable to everybody forever."

If the white hose steps in wealthy purchasers of E9s would be compelled to pay a $100,000 surcharge to keep the E9 affordable for all :shock:
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I am offended that the market for DB5's has put them out of reach of the Everyman such as myself. It's ridiculous that the e type market has exploded to the point where I can no longer replace the one I had for the price of an e39 m5. But there are plenty of other cool old BMWs to be had for smallish money. 2002's are still selling for $20k-30k for super clean drivers, and I think E24 M6's are also very affordable yet pretty special. You can still get a clean. e30 M3 for $20k though it may be high miles and need some restoration. Plenty of good stuff out there. How about the last gen RX7?0
 
Nash said:
No disrespect to Volvo P1800ESs "Lotuss7" :oops:.

They are awesome looking cars and deserve the recognition as well. In fact, any old car somebody else loves is always good/great with me. But, its the hobby and the people we get to meet, I value so much.
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Agreed. What I also appreciate is the variety. So... the Volvo neatly slots into the bigger picture. Many of my local gearhead friends have a similar take on owning classic cars.

This was not about an investment but about a car I really like and pulling the trigger while I can still afford to.

All good fun.
 
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