Car died when starting in the cold.

[decampos]

It's freakishly cold here in England. It's supposed to be early spring and yet right now we have snow, icy winds and freezing temperatures.

I tried to start the car last night, The engine turned, battery sounded full of charge, didn't fire, tried again, engine turned then everything died. No power what so ever.

The battery is connected fine and fully charged, car is completely dead.

Any pointers on where to begin trouble shooting?
Many thanks
Ben

 

[deQuincey]

It's freakishly cold here in England. It's supposed to be early spring and yet right now we have snow, icy winds and freezing temperatures.

I tried to start the car last night, The engine turned, battery sounded full of charge, didn't fire, tried again, engine turned then everything died. No power what so ever.

The battery is connected fine and fully charged, car is completely dead.

Any pointers on where to begin trouble shooting?
Many thanks
Ben

just arrived from london, and yes, it is bitterly cold, but IMHO that is not a reason !

unfortunately my car is not a csi, so i am not familiar with your setup, but generally speaking no fire is due to no fuel, or no spark

 

[mr bump]

My cs does that somtimes, and after a minuite or so, i hear a tick like the sound of a relay resetting itself from behind the glovebox, then it fires up ok. Might be over loading a thermo cut out relay maybee??

 

[decampos]

Thanks for the replies chaps.

My cs does that somtimes, and after a minuite or so, i hear a tick like the sound of a relay resetting itself from behind the glovebox, then it fires up ok. Might be over loading a thermo cut out relay maybee??

That might be it. Though it was totally dead last night (would turn the key and not even the warning lights would illuminate), was as though the battery wasn't connected, I managed to start it up fine this evening as though nothing was a miss.

Thanks again.

 

[decampos]

Argh! It f*cking did it again!

Okay, this is a problem. Though I started the car up last night and it ran fine (it appeared to have 'healed'), I tried to start the car again this evening – I cranked it a few times engine turned, then it totally died again. Nothing, dead. It's an electrical fault of some sort that appears to heal itself. I guess it must be some relay or sorts maxing out or something then clearing itself.

Any ideas how I start troubleshooting this?
Many thanks

 

[Sven]

Eliminate the easy stuff first. I would start at the battery. Pull both terminals - clean, sand, and use a light coat of dialectric grease. Check pos. cable connection at the starter - unbolt and clean. Clean ground connection strap near battery (pull and sand to bare metal). Verify that you have a good ground connection from battery to the engine (should be less than to 0.3 ohms between battery terminal and nearby engine block). Check that the wire from the ignition to the starter is getting power when the key is in the start position. If the starter does not crank after all this, then I would suspect a bad/or discharged battery. I believe you should be able to make the starter crank regardless of what else is wrong with the remaining electronics.

With a fully charged battery do the headlights come on bright, or are they dim?

What voltage are is your battery showing at rest?

 

[deQuincey]

what about the key switch ?
i mean you mentioned that in some occasions you have nothing, no thing, so ...

 

[Honolulu]

Make sure that the starter solenoid connections are good. There is a heavy gage black line from the ignition switch to the solenoid. If its off, you won't activate the solenoid, which activates the starter.

As suggested above, the battery terminals should be verified clean and snug.

Check and report!

 

[decampos]

Thanks for the replies guys. The battery has a full charge and the terminals are good. When I turn the key to the first position it's as though there's no battery at all. Even the radio which would work without the key doesn't work.

What's weird is that this happened the other day. I tried to start the car, car turned over then all the power went out. Left it for a day then it was okay. Tried to start it today, turned over a few times, then totally died.

It's my least favorite kind of problem: and intermittent one.

what about the key switch ?
i mean you mentioned that in some occasions you have nothing, no thing, so ...

I did think it was something like that. It's so cold though opening up the steering column's cowling will be a challenge, having said that, that wouldn't explain why the radio doesn't work. Must be something in the wiring loom. Any ideas?
Thanks
Ben

 

[61porsche]

A not so obvious but common problem is the

Ignition switch coming loose. Pull the cover, turn the key and watch the switch/ back of connections. If it pops out a little, it needs staked or a new switch.

Does exactly what you describe.

 

[deQuincey]

Ignition switch coming loose. Pull the cover, turn the key and watch the switch/ back of connections. If it pops out a little, it needs staked or a new switch.

Does exactly what you describe.

+1
it comes and goes, it can be that one, i said key switch, ok sorry ignition switch
the only issue is that he mentioned that since the beginning there is no radio, as i am not sure if that is related to the ignition switch (i have no radio) i can not say that the ignition switch is the primary cause

 

[Peter Coomaraswamy]

Just a thought

Does the clock work? If the clock is ticking I would go to the ignition switch as well. I don't know how your radio is wired but I have had some minor electrical problems and that clock was a helpful indicator. Next stop.. a good test light (and some warmer weather).

Best of luck

 

[decampos]

Thanks for the replies guys.

Does the clock work? If the clock is ticking I would go to the ignition switch as well...

Well, today I noticed the clock ticking, I turned the key and the warning lights came on as they should (in the first position), twisted the key to start the car, everything died again. So whatever it is seems to reset itself only to trip again when I attempt to start it.

One thing that occurred to me, the battery is about a month old. Could this be related to 'the wrong type of battery'? It's an 096 (what was recommended to me).

 

[Arde]

Battery type is not important as long as it is 12V and enough Amps.
It is clearly electrical, you don't say if clock ticks after it dies which is the key information.

Intermittent is not hard to diagnose if it does it every day and you do not have to be moving. Just measure 12V and continuity to Ground at a few places when it is dead.
Starter, ignition, lighter or clock, maybe load sharing relay.

 

[matthewp]

run an earth straight from your battery to the block, i feel its an earth issue. i had a similar problem. good luck.

 

[Arde]

OK, time for the board to vote:

1) Bad ground to block - run a new one
2) Broken ignition switch - even a wire straight to middle earth won't help
3) Starter woes - quick fix, Honolulu still trying to fix his
4) Poor connection at battery - go punch whoever installed it in his nose
5) A relay is bad sometimes somewhere - follow the click
6) The weather is too damn cold - and the rent too damn high

I vote for 2).

 

[61porsche]

German Cars

Has anyone got an explanation why in the heck german cars in Germany run fine when they're colder there and german cars in the US where it's not as cold have so much trouble?

Did we just get the bad parts? Insert the name of your favorite german car here cause it seems across the board.

Arde- no global warming and snow seals in the suggestion box.

 

[rsporsche]

i would also bet on 2 - ignition switch. have had that issue on 2 bmw of this era.

 

[mr bump]

im going for 5, relay, as my car did exactly the same until i changed the relay and the live terminal on the relay was near burnt. The relay under the dash on the passenger side(uk) drivers side(other). Bear in mind these parts are nearing 40 years old. i tick and somtimes wont do anything and im 43!

 

[mr bump]

run an earth straight from your battery to the block, i feel its an earth issue. i had a similar problem. good luck.

Ive just had a bad earth issue, now my earth runs from the battery neg to the body. then an earth from the bulkhead to the bellhousing of the gearbox, then from gearbox to the engine mount frame, then back to the battery neg. Im putting one from the back panel to the boot floor and also earthing the front headlight frames.

Im a BIG beliver in overkill earthing on these old cars now, there to dam rare to wake up to a pile of ash.