CSL's still in existence

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DJSimca

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I know this topic has been discussed a number of times before - and I suppose we will never know the exact number :(

Therefore my question looking at this from the 'opposite end': How many of you know of CSLs (preferably with VIN number) that have been crashed, have rusted away or otherwise perished :?:
 
Greetings,

To be blunt and based on personal experiences with other vintage race cars, I would NOT suggest "lost / destroyed" CSL's being disclosed. While we all share a common love, there are professional "resoration" shops that will take this information and build a "Lost CSL" within 6 months... No Question.

Case in point, I have a 1960's Lotus race car that has not been vintage raced in almost a decade. Since it has not been "seen", a car with same serial number was offered for sale at auction in England last fall and again in the spring!

In Northern Italy in the late 1970's - early 1980's an infamous person/shop was taking "street" Pre-War Alfa Romeo's and converting them into supercharged, Zagato and Turin bodied Gran Sports by taking serial numbers of "lost cars". The serial numbers of the "street" cars were listed/explained for "parts" used during the restoration. Other valuable cars were separated into two, with frame and/or engine used in one and the original body and or rear end etc used in another and installed on a shortened "street car" chassis. For Sale... Two Cars! A rebody is a rebody but how far does it go?

FYI, an early 1960's Cooper F1 was badly crashed vintage racing in the late 1970's and following "restoration" in California, two cars appeared, one sold to Australia and the other returned to USA or England... same serial number! This was not discovered for over a decade!

Be Careful!
 
Due to my info:

Traced CSLs by 22/6/2009 (number of produced cars in bracket):

2210-2211-2212: 43 (169)
2285xxx: 287 (500)
2275xxx: 158 (429)
2275xxx: 62 (110)
4355xxx: 35 (57)
Racing CSLs: 20 (20)

Broken or stolen CSLs:

2285xxx: 7 broken and 1 stolen
2275xxx: 3 broken and 3 stolen (incl. 2 broken Bats)

With reservation for that some of the broken CSLs might have been restored again.

Cheers
 
It's always worth trying to keep track but a challenge to cover cars across continents. I have been doing this for a short period for the UK BMW CC and will pick this up via a PM to CSL 1973.

A reply to golfcsl 1972 - whilst I agree with your comments re "lost" cars I strongly believe we should be recording broken/destroyed cars. If a car is broken or destroyed and recorded "centrally" people are able to make a check ... if a seller is attempting a previously "broken" car then he/she can be challenged if there is reason to believe (through a record) it was broken, it may be a valid sale but equally it may be that a fraud is being attempted. Yes, there are formal processes for notifying broken cars to national authorities but these aren't always followed and some cars remain "on the books" with probably good intent in the first instance but subsequently slip into the twilight zone. Therefore, it isn't always easy to establish if a specific VIN is/was broken and there certainly isn't any coordination across continents. It's easier to establish whether a car is suject to a credit agreement (at least it is in the UK) than to determine whether it is/was broken.

"Lost" cars are different and although they may include broken cars (known only to the owner) may also include cars that are simply out of the public eye. My own car has been off the road for many years and "out of sight" of the authorities for that period; when it is returned to the road later this year it will still be the same car albeit restored (and modified). In the mean time I'm sure someone might have considered it to be "lost".
 
golfcsl 1972 said:
Greetings,

To be blunt and based on personal experiences with other vintage race cars, I would NOT suggest "lost / destroyed" CSL's being disclosed. While we all share a common love, there are professional "resoration" shops that will take this information and build a "Lost CSL" within 6 months... No Question.
Click to expand...

Appreciate your comment.
My purpose of compiling such list should in fact help prevent and/or uncover the 'chop shop' versions of these cars. I know that other interest groups keep track of 'limited edition' cars in this way. It is important however that the information is not available in the public domain.

I have been keeping track of CSLs (mainly LHD versions however) for a while - strictly for my own pleasure and enlightenment and not for publication.
If anyone would like to share details about their CSL (VIN, a few photos + other relevant details) feel free to send me a PM. Again this will not be distributed in any way.

@ CSL 1973
It sounds as if you have been doing the same thing for a while - perhaps we should compare notes.
 
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