E9 coachbuilder Karmann declares bankruptcy

Bill Riblett

Bill Riblett

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gpetrus said:
This is a link to the Karmann history page with CS production. It says they started production of the 3 liter in April of 1971. I'm curious how many 2000cs bodies they streched out for the 6 cyl and if their is a visable way to know?

http://www.karmann.com/__C1256DF700512B86.nsf/html/en_69dbbd33fb9bc722c1256dc60034ab21.html
Click to expand...
Hard to believe this would have made any sense. For starters, the rear quarter wheel openings are different, then there is the entirely different, shorter front end with completely different sheet metal, different frame rails, and on and on.

On the other hand, years ago, I saw a picture of a 2000CS for sale that had an E9 nose: grills, lights, bumper, etc.
 
Bill Riblett

Bill Riblett

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gpetrus said:
This is a link to the Karmann history page with CS production. It says they started production of the 3 liter in April of 1971. I'm curious how many 2000cs bodies they streched out for the 6 cyl and if their is a visable way to know?

http://www.karmann.com/__C1256DF700512B86.nsf/html/en_69dbbd33fb9bc722c1256dc60034ab21.html
Click to expand...
Hard to believe this would have made any sense. For starters, the rear quarter wheel openings are different, then there is the entirely different, shorter front end with completely different sheet metal, different frame rails, and on and on.

On the other hand, years ago, I saw a picture of a 2000CS for sale that had an E9 nose: grills, lights, bumper, etc.
 
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gpetrus

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Bill,

I could never understand why they used the rear drums on the 2800cs, when at the same time they wen't to all discs on the 4dr 2800. To change the drums to discs on the e9 doesn't require any cutting or change of the master cylinder. That's what led me to think(obviously where I wen't wrong) they extended the bodies.

Both the 2000cs and 2800cs use a 250mm drum, the difference being 4 or 5 holes for the wheel studs. I never knew there were the other differences you mentioned between the two, thanks.



Greg
 
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gpetrus

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Bill,

I could never understand why they used the rear drums on the 2800cs, when at the same time they wen't to all discs on the 4dr 2800. To change the drums to discs on the e9 doesn't require any cutting or change of the master cylinder. That's what led me to think(obviously where I wen't wrong) they extended the bodies.

Both the 2000cs and 2800cs use a 250mm drum, the difference being 4 or 5 holes for the wheel studs. I never knew there were the other differences you mentioned between the two, thanks.



Greg
 
nashvillecat

nashvillecat

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reasons for the drums

gpetrus said:
Bill,

I could never understand why they used the rear drums on the 2800cs, when at the same time they wen't to all discs on the 4dr 2800. To change the drums to discs on the e9 doesn't require any cutting or change of the master cylinder.Greg
Click to expand...

There are a number of plausible explanations for using the drums. They don't have to be particularly reasonable. The factory may have had a surplus of drums and decided to use them up on a low selling model (despite it being the fleet flagship). The factory may have also figured on replacing the model with the 3 liter and wanted to highlight the "new" model's many performance improvements.

While disk brakes seem superior to drums in many ways, the factory continued using drums on the E21 and similar models for several years. I have not made a study of the subject but I believe they are still available. From my window I can see a Prius and a relatively new PU Truck with drums. (I would expect the Prius uses them since they can be adjusted to operate with less drag than disks.)

I am saddened by the reports of Karmann's fate along with many other venerable businesses - but not surprised. (I don't know about the rumor that Karmann was a big recycler, but I have a trunk lid and fender that must have been made out of compressed rust. Naval Jelly should have been installed in the trunk and the window washer reservoir! :?)
 
nashvillecat

nashvillecat

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reasons for the drums

gpetrus said:
Bill,

I could never understand why they used the rear drums on the 2800cs, when at the same time they wen't to all discs on the 4dr 2800. To change the drums to discs on the e9 doesn't require any cutting or change of the master cylinder.Greg
Click to expand...

There are a number of plausible explanations for using the drums. They don't have to be particularly reasonable. The factory may have had a surplus of drums and decided to use them up on a low selling model (despite it being the fleet flagship). The factory may have also figured on replacing the model with the 3 liter and wanted to highlight the "new" model's many performance improvements.

While disk brakes seem superior to drums in many ways, the factory continued using drums on the E21 and similar models for several years. I have not made a study of the subject but I believe they are still available. From my window I can see a Prius and a relatively new PU Truck with drums. (I would expect the Prius uses them since they can be adjusted to operate with less drag than disks.)

I am saddened by the reports of Karmann's fate along with many other venerable businesses - but not surprised. (I don't know about the rumor that Karmann was a big recycler, but I have a trunk lid and fender that must have been made out of compressed rust. Naval Jelly should have been installed in the trunk and the window washer reservoir! :?)
 
H

Honolulu

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hmphf

maybe rather than being sad, we should rejoice that the old rustbucket maker is getting theirs.

But yes, their business model is indeed dead, yet they may stay around for a while under protection from the courts. Can't see light at the end of that tunnel, though.
 
H

Honolulu

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hmphf

maybe rather than being sad, we should rejoice that the old rustbucket maker is getting theirs.

But yes, their business model is indeed dead, yet they may stay around for a while under protection from the courts. Can't see light at the end of that tunnel, though.
 
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