I’m sure this info was available on the old board so I’m sorry to have to ask this again, but I’m starting to gather info on an engine swap. What is the consensus with buying an engine from Metric Mechanic?
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Gathering Engine Options
- Thread starter David
- Start date
x_atlas0
Well-Known Member
The Metric stuff, while it certainly does look good, also seems to be extremely expensive for what it is. The Ultimate transmissions sure do look tempting, though.
I mean, 12k for a stroker? That's just nuts! Paul Cain's 3.8csi had most of the same things the MM motor has, and it only made about 250-260rwhp. If you want speed, you can spend a good 12k for a MM M30 (~250rwhp), 6k for a TCD boosted M30(300+ rwhp), or spend about 8k for a S38 with all the trimmings in excellent condition (~275rwhp, with room for mods later).
I mean, 12k for a stroker? That's just nuts! Paul Cain's 3.8csi had most of the same things the MM motor has, and it only made about 250-260rwhp. If you want speed, you can spend a good 12k for a MM M30 (~250rwhp), 6k for a TCD boosted M30(300+ rwhp), or spend about 8k for a S38 with all the trimmings in excellent condition (~275rwhp, with room for mods later).
decoupe
(deceased)
Engine Options
Part of the decision concerning engines will be based on your own level of expertise and willingness to learn through doing versus convenience and certainty of outcome you will pay MM to provide.
Engine builders like Kormans and VAC are probably in the same cost league as MM for similar rwhp output and for those of us that don't have the time, experience or courage - represent the best route to follow for a top quality motor. There are lots of other very good builders that the Forum could come up with that would also be worth considering - possibly for a lower cost.
For a few dollars more they will all do the install as well or you can save some money by doing the removals and installs yourself.
Or you could buy the pieces, get the machine work done by a good local shop (the boring, grinding, balencing etc) and do the removals/assembly/installations yourself.
I'm doing the later with a m10 as a low budget, non time dependant learning exercise that involves spending as much in tools and shop equipment as actual parts. Something else to consider in how involved you want to get.
This could turn into an epic thread - I look forward to the rest of the comments.
Doug
Part of the decision concerning engines will be based on your own level of expertise and willingness to learn through doing versus convenience and certainty of outcome you will pay MM to provide.
Engine builders like Kormans and VAC are probably in the same cost league as MM for similar rwhp output and for those of us that don't have the time, experience or courage - represent the best route to follow for a top quality motor. There are lots of other very good builders that the Forum could come up with that would also be worth considering - possibly for a lower cost.
For a few dollars more they will all do the install as well or you can save some money by doing the removals and installs yourself.
Or you could buy the pieces, get the machine work done by a good local shop (the boring, grinding, balencing etc) and do the removals/assembly/installations yourself.
I'm doing the later with a m10 as a low budget, non time dependant learning exercise that involves spending as much in tools and shop equipment as actual parts. Something else to consider in how involved you want to get.
This could turn into an epic thread - I look forward to the rest of the comments.
Doug
You'll get a good engine from MM. You'll pay $1,000-$2,000 too much for it, in my opinion. Same story with Korman. I'm not discouraging the use of these shops, just pointing out that what they do is not magic, and you can get equal power and quality for less money if you educate yourself.
Opposite end of the scale -- Bavarian Engine Exchange. You'll get a good price, but what's inside is anyone's guess. I'd buy an engine from a local junkyard before I'd go to BAE. At least I'd get to see the car it came out of and know the actual mileage.
Before you head down this road, you should decide what your goal is. Do you want to retain the carbs, or go with FI? Do you want to maintain the period look of D-Jet, or don't care? Are you replacing due to wear on the original, or for more performance? How much more performance? For what do you use the car -- regular driving, touring, track days? Are you prepared to perform the additional upgrades that are adviseable if you go HP crazy?
Most of what your butt dyno notices is torque. If you swap in a 3.5 and mate it with a 3.64 final drive, your e9 will feel a lot more powerful. Given the availability and longevity of the M30 engine, you could do this swap with a used engine for under $1,000, exclusive of labor.
Opposite end of the scale -- Bavarian Engine Exchange. You'll get a good price, but what's inside is anyone's guess. I'd buy an engine from a local junkyard before I'd go to BAE. At least I'd get to see the car it came out of and know the actual mileage.
Before you head down this road, you should decide what your goal is. Do you want to retain the carbs, or go with FI? Do you want to maintain the period look of D-Jet, or don't care? Are you replacing due to wear on the original, or for more performance? How much more performance? For what do you use the car -- regular driving, touring, track days? Are you prepared to perform the additional upgrades that are adviseable if you go HP crazy?
Most of what your butt dyno notices is torque. If you swap in a 3.5 and mate it with a 3.64 final drive, your e9 will feel a lot more powerful. Given the availability and longevity of the M30 engine, you could do this swap with a used engine for under $1,000, exclusive of labor.
x_atlas0
Well-Known Member
Most assuredly. I did my entire conversion (3.5/Motronic/getrag 265) for a grand total of 1700$, and that is including a very expensive 2002tii brake booster so I could just use the Motronic intake manifold. If I was just doing the engine, it could have been done for less than 700$, excluding labor. After going injected, it was about 1200, (booster upped costs) and then the total with the trans.
Has Todd ever put a turbo in an E9? Not that he couldn't, I just never heard hear mention it.
I wouldn't mine scouting for an M102 which seems like, for a turbo, would be a pretty easy way to go since everything is pretty much done already.
Maybe thow in a '95 M5 6speed
oh, and some larger brakes
any maybe....
I wouldn't mine scouting for an M102 which seems like, for a turbo, would be a pretty easy way to go since everything is pretty much done already.
Maybe thow in a '95 M5 6speed
oh, and some larger brakes
any maybe....
Thanks for the reply. The goal is a very reliable daily driver; solid, quiet, comfortable. Since I don't have the skills or room to do any of the work myself, I suspect this is going to be pricey. I'm OK with that as long as once it's done, I don't need to think about it for many more years. I want this to be the last thing I do to this car and not a new bucket of worms (already did the body work, paint, dash, wood, upholstery, staggers, etc.).
x_atlas0
Well-Known Member
So you pretty much want a turnkey solution, but you haven't said if you wanted more power. Since your bodywork is done, that knocks the S38 out of the running.
Honestly, I'd just get a motor from Bavarian Auto Exchange, have your local mechanic rebuild it, and put that in. It won't have any exotic parts or odd upkeep experiences. A rebuild should run about 5k. Then it's just your basic fuel injection Motronic swap, and the car should run like it is new.
ANYWHERE BUT
See my comments above. This outfit is infamous for half-arsed rebuilds with used parts.
Sorry. I don't "think" I need more power, but I really dont have a good baseline from which to measure. I can say that I certainly do not want the headache that may come with exotic upgrades!
x_atlas0
Well-Known Member
That's why you have a local mechanic you trust do the rebuild. I didn't say to have them rebuild it. The engine I got from them seems to be in perfect shape.