HELP PLEASE - Newbie, about to purchase 3.0 CS(i)?

[hdavis]

Hi,

I'm about to purchase a 1969 3.0 that has been "updated" to fuel injection, and that makes me nervous. I'm far from a fuel injection expert, but I can tell the air filter is incorrect at least, and this kind of air filter makes a lot of noise.
I will have my mechanic take a look at the car before purchasing and will give him the EFI manuals I found on the net to figure out if the ignition is the correct one.

Pic: [Broken External Image]:[URL]http://img134.imageshack.us/img134/5170/dsc01073vo3.th.jpg[/URL][Broken External Image]:[URL]http://img134.imageshack.us/img134/4051/dsc01075mediumng9.th.jpg[/URL][Broken External Image]:[URL]http://img134.imageshack.us/img134/1366/dsc01076mediumsq6.th.jpg[/URL]




Questions for the group:
1.- Should I be concerned about the change, what else should have been changed?
2.- Is the original filter easy to find / expensive?
3.- The car seems to hesitate briefly at around 4500 RPMs, then works fine again after that, like either the ignition or the fuel are cutting off at that point. The strange thing is that it works well after that.

THANKS A LOT[/url]

 

[shanon]

Hello and welcome,

Firstly, if it is really '69, it is NOT a 3.0cs, it is a 2800cs. Basically identical.
It may have a larger motor (3.0+) installed by a PO since it is FI.

Double check to see if any other mods/upgrades have been made, a rear disc conversion possibly. A '69 2800cs would have drums, however disc's are a very nice upgrade as is a larger motor.

Nothing wrong with an early 2800cs w/ upgrades, I've got one. Many clubs/events I have seen recently have pre-1972 cut-off dates......also the earlier the better regarding smog issues.....

can't help ya with the FI stuff, I'm a carb guy...

good luck!
-shanon
'70 2800cs Alpina clone

 

[Jonathan]

First of all, the 3.0 was not introduced until 1970 as a 1971 model! Do you mean that you are looking at a 2800CS? Also, judging from the early 80's wood steering wheel you might wonder how many other items in the car are add ons and possibly wrong add ons (particularly tranny or the injection that you are talking about).

What is the VIN#? This might be a good first step.

Jonathan

 

[hdavis]

Vin # is 2240175, and according to what I know this is a 3.0CS US Vin number. The car might have been registered as a 69 when in fact it is a later car.

Also, in the glove compartment there is a notebook where a PO wrote down everything he did to the car, and there is an entry for change from carbs to FI, that (and the Vin number) tell me that the FI is an add on

Thanks again for the help, I really need it

 

[MichaelP]

Vin # is 2240175, and according to what I know this is a 3.0CS US Vin number. The car might have been registered as a 69 when in fact it is a later car.

According that vin, it's the 175th US '71 model year e9, though it was likely built and delivered in 1970. Doesn't explain why it's registered as a '69, 'tho strange things happen. You might check the body vin at the top front face of the firewall, just to be sure things are copacetic. My guess is that the motor is original, but you can be sure by looking for a matching vin at the rear of the block, just above the starter.

That EFI rig is D-jetronic, most likely from a CSi. It can be persnickity to deal with (search "d-jet" above for common woes), but easily converted to L-jetronic (e12, early e24) which is easier to deal with, though still not programmable. Programmable Motronic (late 80's) is a more common, but also more complicated swap these days.

The correct air filter box is NLA and a little hard to find, but a later box from just about any 80's M30 L-jet or Motronic motor would work fine. You'll also need a rubber boot before the airbox, number 5 in this diagram:
http://www.realoem.com/bmw/showparts.do?model=7032&mospid=47808&btnr=13_0736&hg=13&fg=20

 

[bert35csi]

Welcome Henry, very nice car. What color is your coupe? From the picture, it seems like the color is champagne. About your engine hesitation, it seems like an adjustable rising rate fuel regulator was installed. Make sure you have the correct fuel pressure dialed in correctly.

A few years back, I'd the same engine problem as you have now. I adjusted the fuel pressure, air/fuel mixture, distributor settings to no avail. At that point, I was totally stumped. Finally, I replaced the ignition coil to a Bosch blue coil unit which has an internal resistor(no need for factory ceramic resistor device) and took it out for a test drive and magically the hesitation at around 4500 rpm disappeared. Smooth acceleration throughout the rev range to redline. I supposed the old coil was defective and was not providing the correct voltage for proper ignition firing. This installation of the new coil also cured my bad cold start problems which I previously attributed to the cold start valve, the thermo time switch and the cold start relay. These cold start components were replaced more than once, more than I care to remember.

Your coupe has the 'fasten your seat belt' light indicator which was implemented around the 1971 or 72 US 3.0 coupes. There are various reasons why your car was registered as a 69 2800 CS. It'd be hard to speculate as to why it was done.

The use of the later L-jet air box is not a direct bolt on. I've included several pics of my L-jet installation. The air box is mounted in conjunction with the airflow meter, both units are then bolted onto a mounting bracket. For D-jet installation, obviously, some modifications will need to be done. The old D-jet air boxes come up on ebay from time to time, so keep an eye on their availabiltity. There seems to be more E9 parts that are available on German ebay(ebay.de).

Good luck in sorting out your running issues and please keep us updated.

Bert
72 3.5 CSi (L-jet, 5 speed)
88 M6

This is the stock D-jet airbox setup. Bellow between airbox and throttle body is not stock. It should be a black rubber accordian bellow.

 

[Bill Riblett]

The 224xxxx VINs are US 3.0CS 4 speeds for 1972 and 1973. 2240175 is early enough that it would be for a '72. I have 2240288 and 2240298, both registered as '72s.


While there have been a number of instances where cars have been registered in later years than their VIN would indicate, it seems to me pretty near impossible that a car could have been initially registered for a year several years earlier than its VIN would have been first used.

Seems like something is not right here.

 

[MichaelP]

The 224xxxx VINs are US 3.0CS 4 speeds for 1972 and 1973. 2240175 is early enough that it would be for a '72.

Now that I look at it again, 2240175 would be a '72 build date, but for the record, the green MT coupe book, CSR table (2nd one down) and the ETK show that 132 3.0CS cars were built between April and December of 1971.

Initial registration, and not the build date would determine the year on the title, of course, but given the two or three month difference between build and title dates of many coupes, it's not unlikely that there were a hundred or so US '71 three-point-ohs out there.

This is useless to the issue of the coupe in question's '69 title :roll: but I just thought I'd point it out...

 

[hdavis]

It seems to me pretty near impossible that a car could have been initially registered for a year several years earlier than its VIN would have been first used.

Not if the car is located in Mexico, these cars could not be imported new into Mexico at the time, so a few people succesfuly registered them as used cars to import them, this is not the first car I've come accross with this issue. Not a big deal nowadays anyway.

BTW, I got the answer form BMW Knozernarchiv, the car was produced March 23rd 1972 and delivered April 7, original color was Malaga.

Anyway, after reading all the replies, especially Bert's, and having confirmed the car is virtually rust free (Mexico city is dry and high), I have arranged to purchase the car.

Will surely be back with a ton of questions

Thanks again

Henry

 

[chicane]

It seems to me pretty near impossible that a car could have been initially registered for a year several years earlier than its VIN would have been first used.

Not if the car is located in Mexico, these cars could not be imported new into Mexico at the time, so a few people succesfuly registered them as used cars to import them, this is not the first car I've come accross with this issue. Not a big deal nowadays anyway.

BTW, I got the answer form BMW Knozernarchiv, the car was produced March 23rd 1972 and delivered April 7, original color was Malaga.

Anyway, after reading all the replies, especially Bert's, and having confirmed the car is virtually rust free (Mexico city is dry and high), I have arranged to purchase the car.

Will surely be back with a ton of questions

Thanks again

Henry

Price?

 

[hdavis]

Price?

Low teens, good if you ask me, even with non original color and sunroof. This is a car that needs next to nothing for it to be an almost perfect driver. I might spend $2 or so to sort it out and get another steering wheel in.