No power, black wire, whats up?

7173bmw

7173bmw

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Hi everyone,

I have no idea whats happening! Thought I was having starter problems. Starter has been tested. I've replaced the starter solenoid in the steering column. I've used a voltmeter and realize that i have no power to/from the black wire. I've replaced the starter relay. A red and black wire goes to the small terminal on top of the starter, a green stripped wire from the starter relay to the wide terminal on the bottom of the starter, and terminal wire from the battery to the starter.

What am I missing? Please help!

Thanks!

Nick
 
7173bmw said:
I've replaced the starter solenoid in the steering column. I've used a voltmeter and realize that i have no power to/from the black wire. I've replaced the starter relay. A red and black wire goes to the small terminal on top of the starter, a green stripped wire from the starter relay to the wide terminal on the bottom of the starter, and terminal wire from the battery to the starter.

What am I missing? Please help!

Thanks!

Nick
Click to expand...

You probably mistyped the word "solenoid" instead of "switch."

Unless you have rewired things, for the switch to properly function it needs to be connected to the fuse buss. The wire to the fuse buss may "seem" connected because of the design of the insulators/cover, but it is possible for the wire to be disconnected from the buss terminal/spade. Again, check your connection from the ignition switch to the fuse box.

If you are bypassing the ignition switch for diagnostic or other reasons, please disregard.

Hth.

http://www.e9coupe.com/forum/showthread.php?t=10532


13001001_z.jpg
 
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Thanks Hth,

You are correct...I did mean the starter switch. Fuse box is together and intact. Still nothing.

Nick
 
There should be a Black (No Stripe) wire on the small tab on the starter solenoid that comes from the switch. This activates the starter.
If you have an automatic, that wire goes through the neutral safety switch (actually a relay that is controlled by the NS Sw) as well. This circuit has a black wire all the way from the switch to the starter.
It also shows up in the diagnostic connector, which is an easy place to test if the starter is working or not. If your standing at the fender, it's the upper left hand corner of the connector.

Here is a link to the wiring diagram for 71 to 73.

www.e9-driven.com/Public/Library/BMW-E9-Manual/pages/en/61000400.html#refertoc

DaveG
 
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Since you have replaced the ignition switch , you need to start working downstream.
There is a connector on top of the mount for the brake booster which is where they break out to the Neutral safety switch on an automatic. The black wire on the starter comes straight from this connector on a Manual trans car. These 2 are the most likely places to look. If you have an auto you need to see that the NS Sw relay is being activated as well.
DaveG
 
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Thanks Hth & DaveG!

I don't think I'm having a solenoid problem because when reconnecting the postive line to the battery I can hear the starter engage quickly while contact is made. Also, re-tested the starter after taking it out of a running car.

It is an automatic! I have to check the wiring. Is there 1 thick black and red cable going to the starter post? Is there another cable going to the post? I definitely don't have a thin black going from the starter relay to the starter post, that one is green with grey stripes.

Nick
 
The black wire goes on a flat spade terminal on the solenoid. Not to the large post. That is where the battery cable connects. The spade connector is on the engine side relative to the battery post. If there is no wire there. That is your problem. You'll need to figure out where it went.
DaveG
 
Thanks DaveG!
That makes so much sense. So if the black wire is missing, where would it have come from so I can attach it to the top of the solenoid?
Thanks! This is a tremendous help!
Nick
 
OK... The black wire comes out of the harness near the firewall and goes into the 4 wire terminal block on the top of the brake booster mount (#40 on the wiring diagram). Then it goes to the NS Sw relay (#91 on the wiring diagram) terminal #30. It comes out of the NS Sw relay on terminal # 87.
From there it goes to the starter solenoid, to number 2 in the picture that is a few posts back. Note that there is a connector in the wire between the relay and the solenoid (#90 on the wiring diagram). That's another place where the continuity could be broken....
The wire is probably just hanging somewhere near the starter, if it just fell off of the spade connector. It's a small spade and mine is not any too secure either. But it hasn't come off...yet.
DaveG
 
DaveG said:
OK... The black wire comes out of the harness near the firewall and goes into the 4 wire terminal block on the top of the brake booster mount (#40 on the wiring diagram). Then it goes to the NS Sw relay (#91 on the wiring diagram) terminal #30. It comes out of the NS Sw relay on terminal # 87.
From there it goes to the starter solenoid, to number 2 in the picture that is a few posts back. Note that there is a connector in the wire between the relay and the solenoid (#90 on the wiring diagram). That's another place where the continuity could be broken....
The wire is probably just hanging somewhere near the starter, if it just fell off of the spade connector. It's a small spade and mine is not any too secure either. But it hasn't come off...yet.
DaveG
Click to expand...

Nice post...
 
I think some creative wiring has been done. Upon closer inspection, it appears the double wire that should go to the bottom post of the starter is actually positioned IN the starter relay. When testing the connections for the starter relay, there is a tab that starts a clicking sound(not the starter clicking sound) that seems to come from inside the cab, behind the firewall. One tab/wire goes to the battery, the other 2 are non responsive. So it continues.....


ND
 
Pull both small wires off of the starter and try this.....You should be able to jump between the battery post on the solenoid and the no 2 (in that picture) terminal and the starter should crank the engine. If it doesn't, the starter is bad. Assuming the B+ and ground cables are good.
DaveG
 
We're all good there. I'm gonna reposition some of the wires from the starter relay and see how that goes. I picked up the car as a non runner/project and was told it was running when it was parked.

Let you know in a few minutes!
 
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