Price check - CSL

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9Werks

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I know this is my first post, but I have been lurking here for a while as I search for a coupe to buy. I restore 911's and 914-6's for a living and have always had a sporty BMW thrown into the mix. As all these great german automobiles climb upward in price, I decided I would like to have a CSI to cherish before everything reasonably priced disappears. I was at a Porsche buddy's shop today and saw a CSL (so much for the CSI :shock: )badged trunk in the corner of my eye. He told me it is a real one, and I'm hoping it is. Long story short... I had an empty trailer as I had just dropped off a 914-6, so... I negotiated a price, gave him some cash, and left with the car. My pal told me that if I changed my mind, I could return the car and I would get my money back. Figured I couldn't go wrong with that arrangement.

In looking at the E9 coupes currently on the market, it appears that a really nice one can be purchased for under $25K and set this as my budget. This car is NOT under my budget and I know that the cosmetic details I would want to do to it will not come cheap. What value would you assign to this car in it's current condition? I think I'm up to keeping this unexpected find, but just don't want to be too impulsive and make a wrong decision.

Here are a few details...

Chassis number 2275071
Polaris w/ Black leather interior.
Front hood and rear trunk are alloy.
The windows are all glass, no plexiglass.
No spoilers (German market car?)
The seats are CSI type front and rear (a set of 4 newly restored and correct Scheel buckets came with the car, but are not original to it)
5 spd., not 4 spd.
No significant rust. The rear passenger floor pans were replaced at some point.
Good running engine with no smoke. Drives very well down the road too.

I would like to post some photos, but can't figure out how to do so with this site's format. I can email them to someone else to post while I strive to learn how.

Please let me know if there is anything else that is important. Thank you
 
2275071 is one of the 429 3 litre D-jet LHD CSLs.
http://www.bmwcsregistry.org/Coupe_Information/e9production.html
It should have been originally fitted with Scheels and a 4 speed.
Only the the 167 Batmobiles came with the aerodynamic aids and the German delivery cars did not have the rear wing and roof hoop fitted.
Many E9s were retrofitted with the aerodynamic aids but they are just posers.
 
Welcome.

This question comes up often and never fails to create a very ......passionate discussion. You may find it helpful to run a search on this forum to see the range of opinions that have previously been expressed.

-David
 
CSL 2275071, is due to the records, a city-pack car. Therefore it came originally with steel bumpers, power steering and at least rear power windows. There should also be the normal (like in the CSi) suspension, floor carpets, tools kit etc.

However, like in all CSLs the inner roof and the sun visors should be black and there should be two Scheel seats in the front and with the special CSL fabric front and rear. As for the 380 mm Petri sport steering wheel (in leather for the CSLs), I'm not sure for the city pack cars but I think they also had it.

Congratulations to your CSL!
 
Now that I have the car home and the rain has stopped I was able to inspect it better. Here are some notes:

It is a 4 spd. NOT a 5 spd.
fully carpeted interior
black headliner and sunvisors
manual front window cranks and no electric rear window lifts (how do I get the back windows down?)
rear window defroster
interior hood release
tool kit in trunk
black leather std front and rear seats look original (I do have the Scheel seats that the seller provided)
380mm correct steering wheel
240 KM/HR speedometer
front and rear alloy hood/deck, but doors are not alloy
14x7 wheels
17 or 18mm front and rear swaybars
NO power steering
no front spoiler
euro front and rear chrome bumpers
front and rear US side reflectors

I appreciate all the input so far, especially the links to other informative web pages, but I really would like to find out what a good value range is for this car. I don't know (just have a feeling) what they sell for and I want to make sure I am not paying too much for it. Thanks again, John
 
Hi John,

Unless someone makes you an offer, the best you can do is look at the comps. There are 5 CSLs currently offered on www.mobile.de ranging from EUR 44k to 100k, and one at www.carloft.at/en-cars-bmw_3_0_csl.shtml for EUR 110k - clearly these are offer prices and the strong Euro is an issue, but this will give you a sense of where they trade over here. US prices tend to be lower, which means alot of cars are heading back to Europe - like this one:

www.automobilia.fr/carsforsaleuk.html

which sat at Heritage Classics in LA for years offered at $39k, and is now fixed up and for sale in France for several multiples of that.

Your rear windows are fixed in place, which is typical of many CSLs - seems that yours is a mixed of city/non-city pack options. Your value will be dinged for the steel doors, non-original seats and maybe for the US side reflectors. Does the engine number match the body? That would be good to know.
 
Just a couple of comments on prior posts:
Steel doors were common on city package CSLs.
Carpet should be different than on other CS coupes. It should be black perlon, not loop.
There were several Scheel seat models floating around during the 70s and 80s. There was only one type that was standard on the CSL though.

Also, another distinction between the CSL and the standard cars is the front hood prop. They eliminated the spring tensioner.

One thing is certain: CSLs were sold in several different configurations, so the exception is the rule.
 
9Werks said:
Now that I have the car home and the rain has stopped I was able to inspect it better. Here are some notes:

It is a 4 spd. NOT a 5 spd.
fully carpeted interior
black headliner and sunvisors
manual front window cranks and no electric rear window lifts (how do I get the back windows down?)
rear window defroster
interior hood release
tool kit in trunk
black leather std front and rear seats look original (I do have the Scheel seats that the seller provided)
380mm correct steering wheel
240 KM/HR speedometer
front and rear alloy hood/deck, but doors are not alloy
14x7 wheels
17 or 18mm front and rear swaybars
NO power steering
no front spoiler
euro front and rear chrome bumpers
front and rear US side reflectors

I appreciate all the input so far, especially the links to other informative web pages, but I really would like to find out what a good value range is for this car. I don't know (just have a feeling) what they sell for and I want to make sure I am not paying too much for it. Thanks again, John
Click to expand...

It is very hard to determine the exact value of ANY car with out fully inspecting it and knowing the exact condition, originality, etc. You haven't even given us the mileage on the car. Do you mind telling us how much you paid for it?

So here ya go bud:
http://www.nadaguides.com/default.a...f=5014&y=1972&m=1026&d=1478&c=7&vi=62458&da=1

Somewhere between $25.8K and $65.5K....thank you falling dollar....
 
I would love to send photos to another member to post to show condition. The mileage is 55,xxx km, but I can't help but believe that the odometer has gone once around and it's 155K. The floor pans have been professionally replaced and I really don't see any rust on the car currently. I paid less than $40K for it.
 
Value of CSL

You have made a good purchase--the few good CSL's have been driving prices quickly upwards. Details of yours will ultimately been the determining factor as to the market value for yours.

FYI--and that of the board--a recent sale of an extra fine CS here in SoCal was for $60K--this certainly bodes well for excellent examples of the street versions (that are frankly a lot more suited for long drives in warm climates than a CSL) so the rise in prices that the CSL's are experiencing overseas due to the euro and here for rarity reason(s) is having a beneficial effect on fine examples of E-9's even a non number matching one like blumax. There is a standing offer of $50K for the blumax from a very knowledgable car guy that I have no plan to exercize at this time--even in view of its 409,000 miles--not Km's--it isn't worn out!!
 
9Werks said:
I would love to send photos to another member to post to show condition. The mileage is 55,xxx km, but I can't help but believe that the odometer has gone once around and it's 155K. The floor pans have been professionally replaced and I really don't see any rust on the car currently. I paid less than $40K for it.
Click to expand...

I would post a full set of pics so that the group can sort it out. Carfax isn't much help to cars our age although give them a call you never know. The better chance for tracking the mileage on your car would be to go to your local BMW dealership and give them your VIN (one of the previous owners is bound to have taken the car there once or twice). Also, BMW Mobile Tradition and lastly NHTSA (DOT). You can get some good info from NHTSA including what port your car was shipped from and to.
 
9Werks said:
.. The mileage is 55,xxx km, but I can't help but believe that the odometer has gone once around and it's 155K. ...
Click to expand...

Some CSLs seem to have been driven very sparingly, so it is possible. Mine shows 96k kms and documentation that indicates that is real. And it was a driver at some point in its life.
 
9Werks said:
Now that I have the car home and the rain has stopped I was able to inspect it better. Here are some notes:

It is a 4 spd. NOT a 5 spd.
fully carpeted interior
black headliner and sunvisors
manual front window cranks and no electric rear window lifts (how do I get the back windows down?)
rear window defroster
interior hood release
tool kit in trunk
black leather std front and rear seats look original (I do have the Scheel seats that the seller provided)
380mm correct steering wheel
240 KM/HR speedometer
front and rear alloy hood/deck, but doors are not alloy
14x7 wheels
17 or 18mm front and rear swaybars
NO power steering
no front spoiler
euro front and rear chrome bumpers
front and rear US side reflectors

I appreciate all the input so far, especially the links to other informative web pages, but I really would like to find out what a good value range is for this car. I don't know (just have a feeling) what they sell for and I want to make sure I am not paying too much for it. Thanks again, John
Click to expand...

John:

Your car does fall within the range of "city pack" cars as does mine in an earlier range according to an article by Yannick in 1990. I believe "city pack" cars varied considerably, especially the early ones. My very original 2275030 is similar to yours in equipment. I'm reasonably sure mine only has about 20000 miles on it but can't prove that, yet.

I agree with the perlon vs. loop statement earlier. The black headliners and visors are correct. My car has fixed rear glass windows and manual front windows, steel doors, alloy hood and rear deck (both with prop rods), inside hood release, steel bumpers, no toolbox (although I have seen CSLs with them) the original Scheel seats, manual steering, and a hopefully soon to be corrected non-correct rubber-coated Petri sport steering wheel. Please help me find one guys! {:>) It also has what I believe to be the original Autoflug (w/orange tag) 3-point seat belts. The retractors (Autoflug) are mounted on the rear hat rack.

The side markers are probably a DOT requirement if it has been in the US for a while. I won't comment on value other you did very well given the description you gave. I bought mine very reasonably, and it is not for sale, so my value is the joy of owning it . FWIW

Roger B
 
You car rolled off the assembly line perhaps only a month or two prior to mine. They sound like twins. Honestly one of the coolest things about your car is the manual steering box. Despite the increased effort, especially if you roll the way I do..............oh, uh, that means on 16 inch Alpinas, the feedback is phenomenal. Every time I drive my CSL I have to thank that wanker PJ.

Congratulations on your new baby.
 
This car was delïvered to Italy in October or November 1972.

Manual steering on Stadtpakets is not uncommon.
Most Stadtpakets (and also a few lightweights !) had the hood release from the inside.
 
CSL Sold on eBay

Fast work. What did it sell for? Enquiring--and helpful to you throughoutthis event--minds like to know.
Peter
 
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