SLAVE CYLINDER MYSTERY

hyochem

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co springs, goliad/corpus, tx
i found a post regarding slave cylinder removal. the post did not specify anything as to a solution to my current problem. i have removed shims on both sides of the mounting sleeve. the hydralic line has been removed as well but the slave cylinder will not budge. solutions greatly appreciated.
 
It is probably seized, I would soak either side of the cylinder with PB Blaster overnight (which IMHO is one of the best penetrants around) then tap it with a BFH.
 
re: slave cylinder removal

Caveat: its been a long time since I looked at one of these cylinders and I am doing this from memory.

First, it is always a good idea to squirt the slave cyl with loads of penetrating oil. If possible, allow enough time for the lubricant to work for you.

Next, you need to consider that there is a tang somewhere toward the rear of the cylinder. That tang fits within a rectangular groove on the side of the cylinder. The purpose, I believe, is to prevent the cylinder from rotating. Since you state you removed both shims (I hope you are referring to the pain-in-the-butt "C retaining clips"), I expect you noticed the tang. (I should not mention this but, I will admit to having removed and reinstalled these clips with the use of a couple of flat head screw drivers - when I was too impatient to locate my snap ring pliers. The point is there are many ways to approach this dilemma.)

Third, assuming you have the standard Getrag 4 speed, I seem to recall that the slave cylinder needs to be extracted forward. If you remove the bleeder screw and hose attachment, there is a nice blunt end upon which you can bang to get it loose. I recommend using a plastic faced hammer for this purpose, but other objects may fit the bill equally well. Of course a lot depends upon whether you intend to reuse the cylinder! Please, although you may want to, don't hit the aluminum bell housing that holds the cylinder. If you are good at heliarcing and enjoy fixing broken aluminum, then disregard that advice.

If you have another slave cylinder, I suggest you examine it closely and visualize its correct orientation - as installed. Everything should be much clearer then. Once you fully appreciate the fit, you will note that breaking the rust/grit/crud bond should be a simple matter. As an aside, unless your car sits in a museum, you can see why coating the replacement cylinder with molylube or anti-seize grease is a good idea.

Assuming all of the above is old hat, and you are still stuck, consider taking a big pair of vice grips, attaching them to the cylinder and wiggle the cylinder. (As noted above there is a tang that limits any "substantial" lateral movement. At this time, I can't recall if you can remove the plate which contains the tang or if there is another means of working around the tang.) In any event, a little movement is all it takes to get the whole item loose. If you can't wiggle, then alternate with a couple stout blows to the rear of the cylinder as indicated or wiggle while hitting the vice grips. And, if the vice grips don't provide enough grip or leverage, you can always try giant channel locks or the equivalent.

I am sure there are those who will advocate using heat, in several forms. While I like heat to break things free, I caution against its use because it tends to render things un"reusable" and can pose a considerable danger to and for the uninitiated. The smell of melted undercoating is unpleasant.

IN the end, the fit and removal of the cylinder is rather intuitive. Once it breaks free, you will wonder why you had any problem with it.

Good luck and please tell us of your success!
 
Re: mysterious SLAVE CYLINDER

(':idea:')
You stated you "removed shims on both sides of the mounting sleeve." I interpret this to mean you removed the retaining clips from both sides of the aluminum portion of the bellhousing into which the cylinder sits.

As you are aware, the clips sit in nicely machined grooves. Although highly improbable, it is possible for debris, foreign matter and even an old piece of retaining clip to hide in the groove, so as to act as a key or wedge between the cylinder and the bellhousing.

If you have not done so, please get a flashlight and check that you cannot see anything obvious that might prevent the cylinder from moving.
 
I got it out!! you guys were extremely helpful, thanks! i removed the bleeder and the line and tapped that flat face to get it to move, then the hard part of getting it to go the other way was tackled... just patience, a screwdriver, and a hammer. now if only the mechanics would hurry up and rebuild it for me... gave it to them thursday and still haven't started on it :x
 
Slave Cylinder Rebuild.

hyochem said:

"now if only the mechanics would hurry up and rebuild it for me"

You actually did the hard part. Not to cut your mechanics out of the mix, but rebuilding the slave cylinder is probably easier than its removal. If you have ever rebuilt a brake wheel cylinder, you have something to compare the slave cylinder too.

For the most part there are a couple of rubber pieces to replace. On the other hand, since the slave is exposed to the elements it is possible for the cylinder to develop rust and pitting. Unfortunately, once a cylinder has reached that point, its probably easier to replace or resleeve it.

While on the subject of gratuitous observations, it is probably a good idea to rebuild or replace the clutch master cylinder when replacing the slave. Removal, as you are probably aware, is awkward, but doable with common hand tools and plenty of patience.

As always. good luck.
 
to the advice about rebuilding the cylinder myself: i assumed that one needs special tools. maybe i am wrong?? i hope that it is not too rusted or pitted but a new one is 230 bucks :shock: :shock:

to the advice about the master: i realize that doing that is the thing to do, and eventually i will, i noticed brake fluid-sweat around the connection in the brake master cylinder (not clutch) that is furthest from the booster. so i may be replacing all hydraulic systems very soon... wether i like it or not
 
Rebuild, sleeve or replace slave cylinder?

In my experience rebuilding slave cylinders typically does not require any special tools other than common hand tools (e.g., snap ring pliers) and your fingers. The cylinder diameter is so small as to render most honing tools unusable. A small tube and crocus cloth or wet/dry emery paper is about all one needs. Otherwise, replacement or “sleeving” may be in order.

Sleeving or even Re-sleeving may make sense if you wish to avoid this problem in the future. Cylinders are typically lined with stainless steel or brass. There are many businesses offering this service. Here is just one I noticed on the net: http://www.brakecylinder.com/prices1.htm Unfortunately, you would have to factor the down time when waiting for the work to be performed.

Regarding high replacement costs, here are some other thoughts. If your mechanics do not routinely deal with older BMWs, you might consider contacting others that do deal with our era cars. I cannot suggest any particular retailer, but they are out there. Mesa Auto Parts; Bavarian Autosport, Carl Nelson in La Jolla; Terry Sayther (in Texas) come to mind, but there are certainly more.

As a parting thought, I have heard that depending upon your year transmission bellhousing, you may be able to use the slave cylinder out of another car. I cannot confirm this, but I have heard that the substantially-less-expensive slave from a 73 2002 (part no. 21 52 1 104 269??) may fit some larger model 70's and early 80's BMWs. I do not know if that slave is externally identical to the coupe slave cylinder to fit your bellhousing, but perhaps it is. Since that part 269 reportedly has an internal diameter that is some 2mm smaller than the “260" part, it still may work, but perhaps someone on this board or at one of the above parts sources can confirm this information for you, or state what other slave cylinders may work.

Again, good luck. And if you learn anything about the compatibility of other parts, including clutch hydraulics, please let us know.
 
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