Someone Please Explain BAT Buyers

Ohmess

Ohmess

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So, watching this car sell, it looks to me like a bunch of bidders just charged through a handful of red lights.

Background: from time to time I think I might like to acquire a 91 318is. I like Red over tan, and looked into this one on BAT: https://bringatrailer.com/listing/1991-bmw-318is-67/

I had thought it might have been a nice project, but when I asked whether the speaker under the hood was from an alarm system, the seller responded by saying it is an alarm speaker, and might be a factor system. To me, its rather a big deal if someone cut into the wiring harness to install a bunch of stuff that might render the car inoperative. Well, a VIN check indicates the car came from the factory with an alarm system, and his pictures of the manuals for the car show a separate alarm system booklet. So, this tells me that the seller doesn't know the car very well. Probably a flipper (the Chinese tires were also a sign of this; no self respecting BMW owner puts Chinese tires on a BMW).

I lost interest when it appeared the car was going to sell for more than $20k, and indeed the car sold for $22k.

However, 60 days later the car is back on the market. https://bringatrailer.com/listing/1991-bmw-318is-67-2/

Buyer went through the car and found a bunch more problems he felt were not properly disclosed. Seller refunded his money.

New ad states than an October, 2021 inspection indicates that the air conditioning needs a recharge and that the power steering hoses need to be replaced. The October 2021 inspection also looked at the brakes, but the new ad does not mention this. No estimate of the costs of these repairs is provided. And the "inspection" was done by the mechanic who did the work prior to the first auction. Which likely means it was done in response to the buyer's inspection disclosing problems.

Dirk comments that there is a reason the A/C needs a recharge, for those under the illusion that a non-function a/c system can be repaired cheaply. Then, in the course of the auction, the previous buyer discloses that the radio does not work. Then I question the comment in the description that the fuel lines have been replaced when you can see the factory fuel lines in the pictures. Seller response that was a mistake; they weren't replaced.

So, $22k prior deal falls apart, seller can't say whether the wiring harness has been hacked into to install an alarm, a/c doesn't work and there is no estimate on fixing it, power steering leaks are noted (and the seller had power steering work done prior to the sale), radio is inoperative with no idea why, seller describes work that was not done and when called on it says "oops", and the previous buyer felt there were brake problems. Big discount right? Maybe $15k?

The second auction closes as $21,350. Can someone explain this to me?
 
Stan said:
The car is red and shiny
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Heck, people are paying incredible prices for stocks like GameStop and AMC Entertainment, or intangible "assets" like NFT's. And don't get me started about Bitcoin or Dogecoin. By comparison, the cars on BaT are a deal; at least you're getting a few thousand pounds of steel and copper for your $22K.
 
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On BaT, few people, if any, do their due diligence. Most rely on comments, assumptions or misplaced trust in the seller.

Occasionally the seller is a friend with a 2002, Coupe or something else. When that's the case, I'll write a positive comment. At times I've contacted the seller & bidder, both friends of mine & with permission from both, exchanged contact info. They called each other & the bidder won the auction he called to thank me for the help.
 
it is and will remain a dangerous sport bidding online on something...... if not seen yourself and inspected or at least let it be done by a friend/specialist ...
and i assume , many , in the heat of the moment , go 10...20 % higher in bidding then their intentions were at the start. After all, that's just the reason of those online auctions ....
I would buy private or at a dealer.
 
adawil2002 said:
few people, if any, do their due diligence.
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Which is like most people at an in-person auction, in my limited experience. Why do you think the drinks/cocktails are free for registered bidders?

You’d be amazed at some of the stuff my otherwise intelligent friends have bought at auction. Then 2 weeks later the car they won rolls of the trunk and … it’s the morning after syndrome

I only buy privately and never sight unseen if I don’t know the seller very well, but have done best selling via auction.

John
 
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Don't understand the question. Why do BAT buyers buy what they buy?

I'd probably say 10% of buyers are dealers/flippers.

The other 90% have always lusted over a car that's on sale and will snag it no matter what the costs.

I've purchased at least 10 cars online w/o looking at them. Maybe ONE of them wasn't quite what the seller has all disclosed.

It's a gamble, but so is anything in life. Buying a car (new or used), house, new job, etc.
 
teahead said:
It's a gamble, but so is anything in life. Buying a car (new or used), house, new job, etc.
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Sure, but

I would never buy a house sight unseen and without an expert inspection.

I would not take a job without meeting the management team (zoom is enough).

The 3 times I’ve bought classic cars sight unseen, the sellers definition of excellent has always been significantly below my interpretation of the word. In one case “100% restored, ready to drive cross country,” meant the pistons had broken rings, the head gasket was blown, the diff had been run dry for years (ruining the ring and pinion), and the radiator was 95% plugged (overheated on a 32F day). That was a five figure lesson that I’ve never forgotten.

Auctions rarely give you the chance to do due diligence.

But to your point, I have bought all my DD’s since 2002 sight unseen (from BMW/Merc dealers), but in these cases the service departments always did a detailed PPI for me, and I had agreement to refund the purchase if the condition report was found to be inaccurate.

I’m glad you’ve had the opposite experience. You must be better at picking sellers than me.

John
 
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tferrer said:
More money than brains. When did people stop doing PPI's? It's ridiculous, and I've sold 3 cars on BaT. Great place to sell. Rarely to buy...
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BAT buyers seem immune to warnings from knowledgable posters so the peanut gallery doesn't scare me.
No question that when it comes time to sell my GTV, I'll do it on BAT to maximize the price.

OTOH, If I ever finish and sell my E9, I'll do it through word of mouth. I think E9's deserve a different class of owner that you commonly see on BAT or at a typical live auction.
 
I've never used BAT but have bought a few cars sight unseen. One was my CS. It also goes the other way as well. Recently I was looking at an E28 M535i in Queensland (3000km away). No way to get there, area was in lockdown anyway. Vendor seemed honest, sent lots of pics and was open as to what he thought were the car's issues. Bought it in the expectation of a fair amount of rust and as a non-starter/runner. Car arrived, basically as described. Rust was less serious than described.Cleaned the terminals and installed a clutch slave and it runs/drives. Still lots of work until roadworthy but my point is sometimes you can buy a bargain.

My other observation is the E30 318is is a very desirable car out here, I'm assuming the same in the US. You'd be lucky to buy a good one here for under 25k AUD.
Production numbers are low as part of the E30 class and they have a big following. My guess is people who want one aren't always that worried about the mechanical issues as the parts can be sourced. What does scare them is rust or body filler. In some ways the same as the E9 crowd. Throw in that it's RED and looks to have the factory wheels and some other bits and there's your answer at a guess.
 
I have bought some cars on BaT based on the seller's description, and they turned out just fine. But, they were cheap. I bought a low mile Alfa 164 LS for 6k, and a Mercedes 560SEC for 12k. That's about my upper limit for sight-unseen buying.

If I had unlimited storage, I would have kept both cars forever. The 560 was especially wonderful. In 1988, it was the best built luxury car in the world, and even today, the ride is sublime, and the seats fantastic. But a horrible gas guzzler and not at all sporty.

I have bid on some more expensive cars on BaT, but only after having a friend check it out. Or, in some cases, they were cars that I had seen in person in the past.

This particular 318is? I don't love the engine is those (m42/44), not a lot of torque. They are hard to find with low miles like this one.

I had that engine in my long gone 318ti commuter, which was neat, but just too slow for me; I once owned a 318is, but with an M50 transplant, which was a lot more fun. The chassis had 330k miles on it. I paid 4k for that mongrel, and I sold it for 5k. Fun times. Way before BaT.
 
craterface said:
I have bought some cars on BaT based on the seller's description, and they turned out just fine. But, they were cheap. I bought a low mile Alfa 164 LS for 6k, and a Mercedes 560SEC for 12k. That's about my upper limit for sight-unseen buying.

If I had unlimited storage, I would have kept both cars forever. The 560 was especially wonderful. In 1988, it was the best built luxury car in the world, and even today, the ride is sublime, and the seats fantastic. But a horrible gas guzzler and not at all sporty.

I have bid on some more expensive cars on BaT, but only after having a friend check it out. Or, in some cases, they were cars that I had seen in person in the past.

This particular 318is? I don't love the engine is those (m42/44), not a lot of torque. They are hard to find with low miles like this one.

I had that engine in my long gone 318ti commuter, which was neat, but just too slow for me; I once owned a 318is, but with an M50 transplant, which was a lot more fun. The chassis had 330k miles on it. I paid 4k for that mongrel, and I sold it for 5k. Fun times. Way before BaT.
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Love the Alfa 164. Bought one new in 1991. Drove for 6 years before I sold it. Very nice cruiser. Great experience. Would love another, but I know, it would never match the 1st one. :cool:
 
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