I raced my 2002 and M3 at Road America last weekend. Here's how it went:
Weathertech International from Road America
- Thread starter lafngrvy
- Start date
In the 18th minute of the film, the Honda driver very inelegantly closed you before the corner...
If he hadn't run to the left, he would have missed the turn or hit the drivers in front of you.
Delayed braking in this case did more harm than good...
Apart from that, again a great video of fun on the track.
You have some interesting track lines.
The differences in elevation are very nice.
Regards.
Lucas.
If he hadn't run to the left, he would have missed the turn or hit the drivers in front of you.
Delayed braking in this case did more harm than good...
Apart from that, again a great video of fun on the track.
You have some interesting track lines.
The differences in elevation are very nice.
Regards.
Lucas.
Steve, It was an absolute pleasure to meet you last weekend and chat about awesome BMW history. As well as check out the cars of course. My buddies and I had "Asahi Kiko" on our minds the entire drive home! Certainly the highlight of our weekend!
Looking forward to seeing you and Luigi at legends!
Josh
Looking forward to seeing you and Luigi at legends!
Josh
Long overdue comment: Lucas, I don’t know your racing credentials, but regardless I disagree that the Honda driver had no choice but to move left. Looks to me like the Honda thought he had completely passed Steve and moved left to setup for the corner. The Honda driver did not check his mirror and made a mistake. He looks to have had plenty of track/space to hold his line and leave Steve some space. Also, there is a safe way to squeeze another car against the track edge after a partial pass, and the Honda driver didn’t do it.
John
Hello sir.
I partially agree with you, but why doesn't the Honda driver look in the mirrors and observe the position of the driver he is passing during an overtaking maneuver with delayed braking...? It is solely his fault that this situation occurred. Such things are calculated before the overtaking maneuver.
He was too close to the BMW.
Additionally, as can be clearly seen from the rear camera of the BMW, the Honda driver saw that the BMW was running to the left and was very close to the grassy roadside and in order to enter the corner, the BMW driver must tighten the corner. There was no free space for such a maneuver with delayed braking and with the position of the Honda when entering the corner. It had to end like this...If I squeeze under someone's elbow before a corner when braking is delayed, I need to know how much space I have and how much space I will leave for the overtaken driver.
There was no cold calculation here, just the desire to overtake at all costs.
This is a racetrack. If you cannot calculate and observe the situation on the track, especially during an overtaking maneuver, you should not race because you will hurt yourself or others.
I don't want to jump on the Honda driver, but he made very big mistakes because he wanted to overtake too much.
There was no cold calculation.
There was no observing the position of the driver being passed.
An example from F1.
If the above situation occurred during a Formula 1 race, who would be at fault and what could be the consequences of such a collision in F1 race at the speeds these F1 cars reach..?
I'm not a professional racing driver, but a good friend of mine with extensive experience and achievements in motorsport always told me this:
"When you are on the track during a race, calculate calmly and look in your mirrors, especially when overtaking."
I agree with him completely.
Of course, no hard feelings. I like such discussions and exchange of views.
Generally, I have a heavy foot and I like speed, especially fast corners...
Regards.
Lucas.
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Lucas, I appreciate your thoughtful reply.
As in all things, the skill, attentiveness, and attitude of all involved in vintage racing varies widely. In this race, there is further complication of cars from a wide range of time and with significant speed differential. Reminds me of enduros I run with race cars from the 1950’s through the 2000’s (and where car values span a 500x range).
Finally there is the matter of the red mist, where a driver’s judgement becomes impaired by a desire to win at all costs. Can you imagine going into a corner adjacent to a 250GTO or the original Porsche 904 prototype and forgetting that winning is secondary to not crashing into someone else’s irreplaceable pride and joy? That attitude is grounds for suspension, IMHO.
Anyway, it looked like great fun, Steve appears to be an excellent driver, we are lucky that he restores and uses these historic BMW race cars, and that he provides use with videos.
As in all things, the skill, attentiveness, and attitude of all involved in vintage racing varies widely. In this race, there is further complication of cars from a wide range of time and with significant speed differential. Reminds me of enduros I run with race cars from the 1950’s through the 2000’s (and where car values span a 500x range).
Finally there is the matter of the red mist, where a driver’s judgement becomes impaired by a desire to win at all costs. Can you imagine going into a corner adjacent to a 250GTO or the original Porsche 904 prototype and forgetting that winning is secondary to not crashing into someone else’s irreplaceable pride and joy? That attitude is grounds for suspension, IMHO.
Anyway, it looked like great fun, Steve appears to be an excellent driver, we are lucky that he restores and uses these historic BMW race cars, and that he provides use with videos.
Personally, when driving this Honda, I would be afraid of such an overtaking maneuver, not because I couldn't do it, but because I was afraid that I could damage the BMW and my car without finishing the race.
And if, due to my stupidity and the desire to win at all costs, I damaged a Ferrari GTO or a Porsche 904 Prototype, I would probably feel guilty for the next few years, not to mention the financial costs that could fall on me. Not my league...hahaha.
I would be afraid of such aggressive maneuvers when racing classic cars.
This does not change the fact that I admire people who seriously race classic sports cars and I love watching coverage of such races.
Racing from a bygone era was different from racing today.
Clean, without unnecessary media and without ubiquitous electronics. Pure mechanics and driver skills.
Watching videos of some forum users spending time on the track in their classic cars gives me a lot of fun.
Regards.
Lucas.
And if, due to my stupidity and the desire to win at all costs, I damaged a Ferrari GTO or a Porsche 904 Prototype, I would probably feel guilty for the next few years, not to mention the financial costs that could fall on me. Not my league...hahaha.
I would be afraid of such aggressive maneuvers when racing classic cars.
This does not change the fact that I admire people who seriously race classic sports cars and I love watching coverage of such races.
Racing from a bygone era was different from racing today.
Clean, without unnecessary media and without ubiquitous electronics. Pure mechanics and driver skills.
Watching videos of some forum users spending time on the track in their classic cars gives me a lot of fun.
Regards.
Lucas.
Lucas & John,
I have found that once you are out of the peripheral vision of some drivers you no longer exist. I think this was the case with the Honda driver. Either that or he was exhibiting his SCCA ethic where banging is a common occurrence. Lucas- you are correct in that in vintage racing we should be aware that we are racing irreplaceable cars so we shouldn't be banging into each other. But sadly the red mist often takes over and stupid stuff happens.
I have found that once you are out of the peripheral vision of some drivers you no longer exist. I think this was the case with the Honda driver. Either that or he was exhibiting his SCCA ethic where banging is a common occurrence. Lucas- you are correct in that in vintage racing we should be aware that we are racing irreplaceable cars so we shouldn't be banging into each other. But sadly the red mist often takes over and stupid stuff happens.
The Honda driver clearly took a risk to overtake you when entering the corner. I think he knew it would be very close. Basically side by side. Because of this, there was no room for you to enter the turn.
The most important thing is that no one was hurt. Only pride and cars were damaged.
The car will be repaired and your male pride will be drowned with a few drinks in good company...
That is a wonderful attitude, and what I think is correct for vintage racing. I wish everyone shared that type of thinking. Crashes and damage are an inherent risk in vintage racing, but best if it only happens when unavoidable (mechanical failure, solo crashes, etc.). I've been racing for a decade, have some P1 finishes and have never hit another car despite some very very close racing (I have crashed, which cost a great deal of $ to repair, enough to restore a rusty E9).