How about the lights, bulbs themselves?
Euro Headlights
- Thread starter Bwana
- Start date
I recently bought a set of NOS Hella Bifocus headlamps from the UK (remember when they were $15 each?). I’ll bet there are some Cibe CSR NOS lights floating around in some old French auto parts store that will end up on ebay.fr.
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John
Suggest you setup a search to notify you when something gets listed.
John
Personally. I think that e9’s should have flat lenses, not curved lenses found on the illustrious Cibies. Marchal have curved lenses also but they are a cool novelty.
(@Stevehose has these). I’ve heard good things about the Hella bifocus. IMO, the German e9 should have German Hella H1 high’s and lows. The low beams have a distinct black tinge to them when looking straight on. The bifocus have more fluting on them than the originals, but seem to look the part. I definitely wouldn’t put Japanese lenses on the car for the sake of marginally improved optics.Before adding extra relays and increasing the complexity of your HL system, clean all of your contacts. Ask yourself how much you plan to drive your e9 at night. I’ve always been a lighting nut with H4 upgrades, high watts high bulbs and 30a relays. But my e9 originality nuttiness outweighs any lighting aspirations.
I fully intend to look into LED bulbs. This is one of the reasons why I don’t prefer Daniel Stern. He has spent 20 years dismissing technology that will ultimately render his opinions on HID/LED obsolete. There are some good LED bulbs on the market that work with incandescent lenses.
To me, this whole car project is an exploration; a experienace in learning. When it comes to sourcing the right/best solution, sometimes its the three blind men describing the elephant from different sides. I get some folks like stock, other mods, or electric. In this case, original lights, halogen, LED. I welcome it all and will gather what information I can meet my ever-changing objective. I would like to have a sleek wiring solution, so I like your idea of not adding more wiring. I'm not married pure stock, I do like good lighting, and I really wanted the parking light but can live without it. I'm currently of the mindset to rebuild my wiring harness (I like new electrical parts) or have it done, so its a great time to focus on that.Personally. I think that e9’s should have flat lenses, not curved lenses found on the illustrious Cibies. Marchal have curved lenses also but they are a cool novelty.
Before adding extra relays and increasing the complexity of your HL system, clean all of your contacts. Ask yourself how much you plan to drive your e9 at night. I’ve always been a lighting nut with H4 upgrades, high watts high bulbs and 30a relays. But my e9 originality nuttiness outweighs any lighting aspirations.
I fully intend to look into LED bulbs. This is one of the reasons why I don’t prefer Daniel Stern. He has spent 20 years dismissing technology that will ultimately render his opinions on HID/LED obsolete. There are some good LED bulbs on the market that work with incandescent lenses.
Markos, being more specific, are you suggesting swapping out the current attachment for the 3 pin H1 and H4 receptors? I think the last lights on this car were sealed lamps. If so, would you not want to run a seperate relay to offset the load on the system?
When I had my 2002 - and drove it daily as my only car (for well over 100,000 miles) back in the 80's - I found the regular headlights lacking.
So - being a tinkerer....
I installed Cibie BOBI headlights (with 70/100W H4 bulbs) paired with Cibie OSCAR driving lights with 100W H2 bulbs All was powered using relays with new wiring made so the driving lights came on with the high beams (or they stayed off). Had lots of time driving on the twisty back roads at night - and LOVED it. See pics... I know the shape of driving lights aren't everyone's favorite - but for me (and my college budget) - they were great.
You can see the console I had in the car as well - the switch on the right was for the driving lights - the switch received power from the high beams. When on, that power then went to the relays for the driving lights (or if the switch was off - no driving lights with high beam).
That being said - With 400W and my stereo and windshield wipers and ... whatever... pulling from the battery - the headlights sometimes kept time to the stereo. LOL
My next step was to install an alternator out of a 320i (E21) with internal regulator (and a boosted regulator at that - so I was putting out ~70A or so).
The load was managed with that new alternator - no prob.
That complete set up worked great till I sold the 02 a few years back. I wish I kept that car... But I hardly ever drove it after I bought the Coupe... Still... I do miss it. Such a fun and tossable car.
So - for me, while I don't expect to drive the car all that often at night - when I do, I DO WANT to have very good lighting...
SFDon is taking care of me that way for the Coupe.
YMMV as always...
Cheers
So - being a tinkerer....
I installed Cibie BOBI headlights (with 70/100W H4 bulbs) paired with Cibie OSCAR driving lights with 100W H2 bulbs All was powered using relays with new wiring made so the driving lights came on with the high beams (or they stayed off). Had lots of time driving on the twisty back roads at night - and LOVED it. See pics... I know the shape of driving lights aren't everyone's favorite - but for me (and my college budget) - they were great.
You can see the console I had in the car as well - the switch on the right was for the driving lights - the switch received power from the high beams. When on, that power then went to the relays for the driving lights (or if the switch was off - no driving lights with high beam).
That being said - With 400W and my stereo and windshield wipers and ... whatever... pulling from the battery - the headlights sometimes kept time to the stereo. LOL
My next step was to install an alternator out of a 320i (E21) with internal regulator (and a boosted regulator at that - so I was putting out ~70A or so).
The load was managed with that new alternator - no prob.
That complete set up worked great till I sold the 02 a few years back. I wish I kept that car... But I hardly ever drove it after I bought the Coupe... Still... I do miss it. Such a fun and tossable car.
So - for me, while I don't expect to drive the car all that often at night - when I do, I DO WANT to have very good lighting...
SFDon is taking care of me that way for the Coupe.
YMMV as always...
Cheers
Attachments
i was thinking that @Stevehose has marchal headlights and foglights. i know i sent him a set of marchal highbeams 4 or 5 years ago.Personally. I think that e9’s should have flat lenses, not curved lenses found on the illustrious Cibies. Marchal have curved lenses also but they are a cool novelty.
Is this a cry for a gratuitous pic? Yellow driving and high beams, white low beams.
why yes it is ... simply gorgeous. love those Marchal crests.
i missed that, 'fake news', you must have gone back and edited your post. .in my POTUS tweet voice'That is what I said.
(tongue firmly planted in cheek)
mmccusername
Well-Known Member
Adding a lo beam relay just makes sense. Power goes from ign key to light switch to dip stalk to lo beam, all with 14 or 16g wire and no fuse! These wires now become the trigger wire only for the relay and power to lo beam is battery to relay to lamps.
I have to be honest, those would look better on my car. What's your address?Is this a cry for a gratuitous pic? Yellow driving and high beams, white low beams.
Converted Athena in 2014 to H1/H4 with city lights from sealed beams. Her lights are as good as our 2007 & 2014 BMW X3's adaptive Xenons for brightness & clarity. Of course VSR handled the relays & installation.
Also converted Vern the Tii from sealed beams to H4 with city lights as well as Rodney the M5 to Euro lights also with city lights.
Also converted Vern the Tii from sealed beams to H4 with city lights as well as Rodney the M5 to Euro lights also with city lights.
There can be more than one solution to a problem.
First, your expectations for what constitutes good lighting can differ significantly from others. Therefore what solution meets your needs can be ifferent than what meets mine. So getting multiple opinions is, imho, a good thing.
Second, I believe good solutions have been reported for many of these different approaches (all but 1).
Third: therefore I think it incorrect to characterize multiple good solutions as blind men misidentifying the whole issue. It’s more like 3 blind men arguing about what’s the right amount of water to put into a good scotch whiskey.
Fourth, some folks prefer not to wade their data, and want a simple-definitive, “this is the one truth so just do this one thing.”
IMHO you’ve already received enough advice to have at least 3 good solutions. FWIW, I’ve never regretted following HBChris’ advice. If you agree you could stop reading here and go buy something ...
But if you are an information addict (I am), here is more opinion to complicate matters
I’ve used these
(1) commonly avail flat face Hella’s,
https://www.rallylights.com/hella-5-3-4-round-ece-high-low-beam-headlamp-no-bulb-hl79564.html. AFAIK, the overall design of these has not changed in decades. When they get cloudy (film on the inside of the lens, they can be cleaned but avoid harsh chemicals as theinternal silvering is not robust like paint. Acetone will take the silvering off but windex seems ok.
(2) the NLA Hella bifocus low beams with #1 high beams.
(3) Cibies (non CSR), from the mid 1980’s, which look like what Daniel Stern sells. I remember then these were under $20.
(4) USA DOT sealed beams.
Of these 4, only the DOT sealed beam #4 provided less than acceptable night lighting for my aging eyes. #2 was the best but I’ve remove the bifocus because of their rarity and I didn’t feel I needed their extra performance. None of these are as good in uniformity as the best headlights I’ve used (bi-Xenon on BMW E60 and single Xenon on Mercedes W166). YMMV.
LED: I’ve seen a few LEDs in incandescent housings. Some were horrible and some were almost as good as the aforementioned 3 good ECE solutions. The good ones were very bright but had only modest uniformity. I hate lights that put too much light close to the car because it hurts your ability to see into areas further away. I subscribe to the notion that you shouldn’t over drive your vision so more light further out is far more important to me that perceived overall brightness of the entire visual field.
I don’t feel the any of the hybrid LED bulbs in incandescent housings would improve on the Euro halogens in any of my old cars. But, I have a friend (RIP), who retrofitted the complete OEM 7” LED assembly from a modern car into a 1960’a car, and those worked very well (eg not just a bulb change).
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And yes I’m being a bit of a prickly jerk today. But I mean well.
Seeing how your a Bostonian I just took it at face value, as direct, clear communication. What you suggest is what I'm doing, collecting data, comparing the results to what I seek, and making a decision. I think your post was exceptionally helpful, thank you. I've had enough high performance cars, which have been exercised to their potential, to know what I want for visibility. What I don't know is what I don't know, especially with this car. I do know how to take it apart! (The easy part). So yes, I'm a big fan of relays. I will look for some of these old lamps, and I need to remind myself to be patient, yet diligent. I do like the flat lens but I can live without them. Worst case, I now know which cars to raid! lol
Takeaways
(1) Avoid analysis paralysis.
(2) Euro eBay sites are your friend
(3) Hellas are good enough
(1) Avoid analysis paralysis.
(2) Euro eBay sites are your friend
(3) Hellas are good enough