Where is the earliest Factory built RHD 3.0CSi

[Barry.b]

Hi guys
I am trying to find out if my car is unique.
I have a factory built Right hand drive
3.0 csi built on September 4th 1974

it is not a converted LHD as was previously suggested. BMW archive have confirmed this themselves.

the Vin number is 2265998

so is it one of the 66 3.0 csi’s built in 1973 and should that now be updated to say
67 ?

is it one of the first ???

I did touch on this question at the start of this year and I did get a lot of help with information, so thanks again to everyone who helped then !!!

I suppose, I am wondering if anyone has actually a bit of insider info from Karmann from 47 years ago ?
Did anyone work there ? Or live in the same town and know someone who knows someone or something
Any bit of extra info to solve the puzzle would be great !!!

 

[HB Chris]

Barry, the 66 are Facelift Modell 73 coupes (in the US called a 74), yours is a pre-facelift coupe.

 

[MarcH]

Hi guys
I am trying to find out if my car is unique.
I have a factory built Right hand drive
3.0 csi built on September 4th 1974

it is not a converted LHD as was previously suggested. BMW archive have confirmed this themselves.

the Vin number is 2265998

so is it one of the 66 3.0 csi’s built in 1973 and should that now be updated to say
67 ?

is it one of the first ???

I did touch on this question at the start of this year and I did get a lot of help with information, so thanks again to everyone who helped then !!!

I suppose, I am wondering if anyone has actually a bit of insider info from Karmann from 47 years ago ?
Did anyone work there ? Or live in the same town and know someone who knows someone or something
Any bit of extra info to solve the puzzle would be great !!!

Hi Barry
Mine is a RHD 3.0 csi with a VIN number 2265649 - BMW Archive have previously confirmed the build date as 27 August 1973 and delivered to the UK on 17 September 1973. Have to say when undertaken a full N&B resto it does look like a converted LHD but maybe now I will go back to BMW on this point. I believe that early E9's delivered to the UK were actually LHD and converted by BMW concessionaires to RHD
Hope this helps

 

[Barry.b]

Hi there, thanks for the info.
I did a bit of digging back around Christmas time/ January earlier this year as I too had heard the story about the conversion of some LHD cars by BMW consecionaires in Dover to make them into RHD cars when new.
That did not happen to my car ,
and after contacting Bmw Heritage in Germany regarding this, they confirmed to me that some early 3.0 RHD cars were indeed built at the factory on 2265…. Vin numbers.
So I was wondering firstly how many were built in the first place and then also how many of the 2265…. Factory RHD cars are left in the world today.
I have since moved the Karmann plate on my door pillar to try and see what the karmann shell number was and mine is stamped 15342
Anyway there seems to be approximately 27 RHD e9’s on 2265…. Vin numbers registered with this forum.
Of those 27 I don’t know if any or all were converted LHD cars
Maybe I’ll never know ..,, and I think that’s okay too

RHD 3.0 CSI with a 2265 vin number

Hi guys I have a mystery on my hands I have a 1974 3.0csi and it’s vin starts with 2265 . It seems that should mean it’s LHD can anyone confirm what was happening in 1973/1974 to make the e9’s RHD for the UK market . I heard yesterday that they may have been converted ???? If mine was...

e9coupe.com

 

[HB Chris]

Barry, I think it is safe to assume that all 2265xxx RHD CSis were factory built, only the 2800CS was converted the BMW Concessionaires. The 2265xxx are all mid to late build dates and not early however as we don’t have any 2261xxx in our Registry.

 

[Markos]

Barry, I think it is safe to assume that all 2265xxx RHD CSis were factory built, only the 2800CS was converted the BMW Concessionaires. The 2265xxx are all mid to late build dates and not early however as we don’t have any 2261xxx in our Registry.

A few snippets from a book of mine.

 

[Ian C]

Hi Barry, my 2800cs, 2206200, was ordered at a car show, not sure where, and built RHD Feb 1971. A hard drive crash has lost my info from BMW heritage, but I think it was delivered in Melbourne April 71. Perhaps yours was also a special order

 

[Barry.b]

A few snippets from a book of mine.View attachment 121835View attachment 121836View attachment 121837View attachment 121838

Okay
Thanks for the info !!!
I had a look earlier to see if that book was still available somewhere , it looks like a good read !
That seems to be a very good book ,
I did see one advertised , it is a bit pricey though , I think for now I might spend the money on the car ….
I could probably get a couple of rear view mirrors and maybe a new electric aerial, or maybe a new windscreen seal or maybe new seat belts with that money …. who knows , the list is endless !!
But seriously thanks again for the info !!

 

[Barry.b]

Hi Barry, my 2800cs, 2206200, was ordered at a car show, not sure where, and built RHD Feb 1971. A hard drive crash has lost my info from BMW heritage, but I think it was delivered in Melbourne April 71. Perhaps yours was also a special order

It is interesting to try and find all the pieces of the puzzle from back then and imagine how the first owners lived.
It was quite the car back then !
And also today of course !!

 

[Markos]

Definitely not a $250 book. I paid $40 for mine. It was written in the 90’s and isn’t telling much that we don’t already know. A few interesting UK-specific nuggets of info however.

Okay
Thanks for the info !!!
I had a look earlier to see if that book was still available somewhere , it looks like a good read !
That seems to be a very good book ,
I did see one advertised , it is a bit pricey though , I think for now I might spend the money on the car ….
I could probably get a couple of rear view mirrors and maybe a new electric aerial, or maybe a new windscreen seal or maybe new seat belts with that money …. who knows , the list is endless !!
But seriously thanks again for the info !!

 

[Barry.b]

A few snippets from a book of mine.View attachment 121835View attachment 121836View attachment 121837View attachment 121838

Here are some other cars on the uk market in the early seventies for price comparison

 

[roundel]

I worked for BMW dealer in the early 1970`s I remember seeing a couple of 2800CS cars that had been converted from LHD to RHD in Dover. They were not pretty....as you can imagine the complications involved especially when the factory had yet to make any RHD E9`s....to convert the braking system they fitted a clutch master cylinder to the brake pedal and a clutch slave cylinder was used to operate the `still on the left side ` brake master cylinder. I think if you own a car converted in the UK it would be very obvious as the steering column mount / pedalbox was modified to fit on the right, as was the dash. These parts did not exist at this time. Also the cut out in the bulkhead for the steering column was very obviously not factory. I also recall many 72/73 CSi`s that were obviously built at the factory. Seems to me only 2800CS cars were converted in the UK...

 

[Wes]

My 1972 CS, originally a CSA was UK delivered as a RHD according to BWW. I added the details on another thread on this somewhere.

 

[beamer]

Hi, my RHD UK supplied 72 3.0cs has a lhd
modified pedal box presumably converted by bmw concessionaires Dover.

 

[Barry.b]

Hi, my RHD UK supplied 72 3.0cs has a lhd
modified pedal box presumably converted by bmw concessionaires Dover.

Hi, my RHD UK supplied 72 3.0cs has a lhd
modified pedal box presumably converted by bmw concessionaires Dover.

Hi there
As your car is a 3.0 does it have a 226… vin number or does it have a 43… vin number .
Also do you have any photo’s of the braking system that was fitted during the LHD to RHD conversion.
I would love to see some if you had .
I do not have that set up . I have the standard RHD setup as you can see below. - please excuse the 47 year old “patina “

 

[Barry.b]

I worked for BMW dealer in the early 1970`s I remember seeing a couple of 2800CS cars that had been converted from LHD to RHD in Dover. They were not pretty....as you can imagine the complications involved especially when the factory had yet to make any RHD E9`s....to convert the braking system they fitted a clutch master cylinder to the brake pedal and a clutch slave cylinder was used to operate the `still on the left side ` brake master cylinder. I think if you own a car converted in the UK it would be very obvious as the steering column mount / pedalbox was modified to fit on the right, as was the dash. These parts did not exist at this time. Also the cut out in the bulkhead for the steering column was very obviously not factory. I also recall many 72/73 CSi`s that were obviously built at the factory. Seems to me only 2800CS cars were converted in the UK...

I wonder when they did the very very first conversion, who was the brave soul who got the job of test driving it and seeing that it would actually stop when needed….
Was it a BMW design engineer or was it one of the mechanics who actually did the work on her with his or her own hands
Or was it left to the new owner of the car ???

 

[beamer]

Yes vin starts 236, will try to find some photos as car is now stripped to a bare shell awaiting restoration. Braking has the two servos as you have.

 

[beamer]

Vin starts 221 not 236 as in previous post. has square cut out in bulkhead at rear of servo

 

[Barry.b]

Okay just now wondering if you also have a photo of the bulkhead showing where the cutout for the steering Colum is , as apparently that cutout is where the shells differ.( As well as the metal supporting the dash itself inside the car )
I have never actually seen a “ Dover cutout “ for the column apparently they do look obviously done by hand and not by the factory press tools.

 

[Barry.b]

I have shown a factory RHD in primer and the green one is a factory LHD, but I have not seen a photo of “Dover LHD to RHD conversion “ (yet )