1972 3.0 In Scottsdale

[digixjairo]

Has anyone seen this car in person?http://www.hemmings.com/classifieds/dealer/bmw/3.0cs/1790112.html? They just dropped the price, and they will be sending pictures of it on a lift. If the paint color of the car was changed from the original color, does that diminish the value?

 

[tferrer]

Looks relatively good accept for the fact they have avoided taking any shots of the problem areas AND it looks like some type of non factory material has been applied in all the areas you actually want to see...PPI is the next step

 

[HB Chris]

Looks pretty nice from the pics and looks like paint completely covered the Ceylon gold. If truly solid that is a good price IMO.

 

[digixjairo]

Here is the link to the rest of the photos: https://www.dropbox.com/sh/rl3w2jkf69xr4rl/AABRCt9oAaD_3chdflFjkYkWa?dl=0

 

[Bez]

Looks like a clean coupe from the pics on Hemmings (with the exception of the speaker grille) but based on the pics on dropbox showing all the rust bubbles, this car will be in need of rust remediation and paint. Based on my experience, probably will cost a min of 15k to 25k+. A coupe is worth all the money if rust remediation/bodywork/paint are documented with pics.

 

[digixjairo]

Looks like a clean coupe from the pics (with the exception of the speaker grille). Worth all the money if rust remediation/bodywork/paint are documented with pics. I may be wrong, but based on the pics, it looks like they just painted over the rust.

That's the feeling I get from seeing the photo of the bubbling. And I agree that speaker grill is ruining that dashboard.

 

[Arde]

I think that the seat release knobs on driver and passenger seats are mismatched (round vs flat).

These details are akin to the "broken windows theory" in sociology and tell you a lot about what to expect elsewhere...

Otherwise it looks nice.

 

[teahead]

For $40k, there should be ZERO rust bubbling of any kind. Surface, OK. But bubbling is a sign most likely, to be deep cancer starting to rear its ugly head.

I'd pass.

 

[adawil2002]

For $40k, there should be ZERO rust bubbling of any kind. Surface, OK. But bubbling is a sign most likely, to be deep cancer starting to rear its ugly head.

I'd pass.

At the same time it does not look like anything terminal that would need to be fixed immediately upon purchase. I bet the person who buys this could enjoy it for years before having to address the few rust bubbles here and there. If I were looking I'd look very closely and do my due diligence with a PPO.

 

[shane]

bmw

please call me about your car thanks 402-301-7157shane

 

[digixjairo]

please call me about your car thanks 402-301-7157shane

Hi Shane,
You can call the dealer directly. And I think they are desperate to move the car.

Eric:
Eric Lee, Sales Manager: [email protected]
Phone: 480-483-4682

I think I am going to pass on this one. But if I were you, I would get a PPI.

 

[Bez]

At the same time it does not look like anything terminal that would need to be fixed immediately upon purchase. I bet the person who buys this could enjoy it for years before having to address the few rust bubbles here and there. If I were looking I'd look very closely and do my due diligence with a PPO.

Andrew. That's the same thing you thought about my coupe and I ended up spending close to 25K on rust remediation and PARTIAL paint at VSR. My car looked better than this on the exterior. You really have no idea what LURKS underneath the paint until you start taking things apart.

I am not saying it may need the same amount of work but I agree that for 40k in the current market, it should not have rust bubbles lurking underneath the paint. It is an omen

 

[Markos]

Andrew. That's the same thing you thought about my coupe and I ended up spending close to 25K on rust remediation and PARTIAL paint at VSR. My car looked better than this on the exterior. You really have no idea what LURKS underneath the paint until you start taking things apart.

I am not saying it may need the same amount of work but I agree that for 40k in the current market, it should not have rust bubbles lurking underneath the paint. It is an omen

I'm curious to know what problem areas drove you to move forward with such an investment. Was the car unsafe?

 

[Bez]

The Flexible Flyer!!!!

I'm curious to know what problem areas drove you to move forward with such an investment. Was the car unsafe?

In September 2013, Andrew thought the car was worth 21k "all day long". I payed 16k for it. In retrospect it was probably worth more like 10k.

When Mario first looked at the car, he anticipted 6-8k or so for rust remediation. No known safety concerns at the time.

Then they started taking it apart...

Mario: "We have removed the interior floor under coating, the outer rocker panel covers and exposed all the rust. The rust is much more extreme than anticipated...

Estimate:
220 Hours labor @ $67.00 hour $14700.00
plus sheet metal parts
2 rocker panels
4 floor pieces
2 side lower fender
1 left side lower A-Pillar
2 lower rear quarter panel repair panels

All the above parts are from W & N

+paint and materials as we'll need to do paint work on the outside

+/- 850.00"

I figured I would put in $15k for rust remediation, $5k to redo interior, and $5k for mechanical upgrades and have a nice coupe for $40,000, which is roughly what a nice coupe was selling for in late 2013. But I would know exactly what I have. So ai thought.

As work progressed, more rust was discovered...

Mario: "Taking into consideration the new repairs needed, Steve estimates there is another 3 weeks of labor in the car to remove all the rusted rocker components, weld in replacements, and finish all of the rust repair. This will get the car to the paint/primer ready stage, at which point paint and reassembly would be the next step.
The invoice does not reflect any of the new rocker/b-pillar support pieces that need to be ordered from Germany."

Estimate: $4576.24"

And then the kicker...

Mario: "On a side note, during repairs along the right side of the car we found that there were never any spot welds across the bottom of the A-Pillar and the bottom of the B-Pillar! Had our repairs not gone as deep as we did, in a short period of time along with improvements to suspension and other items on this car, this car would have had door alignment issues and would have driven like a Flexible Flyer!"

Final bill after partial paint was close to 24k!!!

When I picked up the car from Bow....Mario told me he road tested the car and thought it is one of the most solid coupes he has ever driven.

 

[Markos]

Wow that sounds like an ordeal. It confirms my assertion that a 15K car is the worst kind of e9 investment. I know VSR is well respected, but I have to question how it would take a shop three labor weeks (or 68 hours according to your bill rate and cost) to do the rockers.

I look forward to cracking open my car. I am under the naive assumption that i can cut, remove, and re-weld prefabricated sheet metal pieces in under 70 hours. I am slow at everything I do. It will take me two months, but I don't think it will take 70 hours. I'm sure that the painting and sanding will be incremental on top of that. Fortunately I will log my fab hours in my build thread down to the 1 hour level. I won't forget about this statement so I'll be sure to provide the update if/when I eat my words.

I do think that if you get your coupe out of the elements and the car is safe, there is no reason why you can't enjoy it for a while before hacking it to bits yourself, or loaning it to a shop for two years.

 

[digixjairo]

You guys are scaring me. I'm going to seek a rotisserie top notch Pinto instead.

 

[teahead]

Wow, ya, unfortunately, you can get:

an $8k car that's a complete rust bucket and lucky if it's complete w/decent parts on it.

$15k, it's complete, but should have less rust on it, but still be prepared for some bad chit.

$20-22k, this too is a gamble. It may LOOK nice, but again, you have an issue w/rust lurking unless it can be proven it's been in a dry climate/garaged all of its life.

Anything >$25k should only have surface rust on floors. NO BUBBLES! Especially the front fenders/rear quarters as this will require removal.

Bez, I think you actually came out ahead. You spent $40k on a car and it's now KNOWN TO BE SOLID! True, it'll probably take another $10k to get it repainted to complete the restoration, but it's better than spending $30-40k on something that looks nice on the outside, but a turd underneath.

 

[teahead]

Wow that sounds like an ordeal. It confirms my assertion that a 15K car is the worst kind of e9 investment.

I dunno; I think you can get lucky.

That's how much I spent on this 2800 I just got and it really does appear to be 90% rust free from what I can tell. Been in CA all of it's life and transferred the title from the original CA pink (actual PINK!) slip.

The cowl/engine compartment has ZERO rust, and I can only see one spot on the floors that's maybe 1/2" long that there's a tiny rustout.


If in the $40k+ market, try to find one already restored with documentation of the rockers, front fenders off, etc. all done.

 

[digixjairo]

That is my biggest fear, spending $40k on one that will need $25k on body work.

 

[Peter Coomaraswamy]

Keep looking, knowledge is the key. The more you look the more you learn. The trick is knowing what you are getting into. The car I bought from Mario almost 1 year ago had very little rust, it did need partial front floors and a total cleaning. The welding and fabrication probably took about 15 hours and the cleaning (not quite finished) is in the 100 hour area. The car is a pleasure to work on because all the parts are there and just need cleaning. I tell this tale because if you know what you are getting into then the work becomes fun and not a chore or a money pit.

Some other forum members have come and visited my little warehouse and gotten a complete tour of the underside of the car and you are welcome too. Or, you could find a forum member in your area and do a complete tour of their car- most of us are more than willing to show off our little ladies.

It's a great way to learn and make friends. Tip- bring wine or beer... or...