Wondering if there are ways to tell how/if our beautiful coupes have rolled over 100,000 miles? Worn clutch/brake pedal pads? Mine look beautiful at 83,000 miles, or is it 183,000 miles?
5 digit odometer
- Thread starter bill
- Start date
driver seat condition? assuming any and all ideas are original to the car...
Interesting thought!
thinking about this, i would consider that to do this, one must look at elements of a car that degrade over distance travelled, and not by time.
So that limits to things that wear such as pistons, brake discs, etc.
Indeed also seats wear over time, but they also suffer from time (=sun exposure + geographical location). seat with 100.000 miles stored indoor in Sweden will look better then seats with 100.000 miles from outside storing in Texas.
Dilemma is that anything can be replaced. Brake discs for instance live about 100.000 miles (plus minus 75.000).
Wear parts inside the engine can suffer from more or less wear due to not enough/incorrect grade/too old oil.
I think that timing chain or sprocket would be good indicators as they have a sort of constant wear, as they are, i think, not influenced by time or lubrication. (perhaps by driving style?)
However that would need a certain aspect to be measured (e.g. depth of the teeth of the sprocket), but it also needs an esthablished relation between miles vs that specific wear mechanism.
Perhaps the best route is to track previous owners. But I understand that it could be difficult as well.
The reason that there is no simple answer: many people wonder the same thing when the buy a second hand car - To date no good (easy) indicator has been identified; thus we have a law in the Netherlands against fiddling with the Odo meter for sales purposes.
thinking about this, i would consider that to do this, one must look at elements of a car that degrade over distance travelled, and not by time.
So that limits to things that wear such as pistons, brake discs, etc.
Indeed also seats wear over time, but they also suffer from time (=sun exposure + geographical location). seat with 100.000 miles stored indoor in Sweden will look better then seats with 100.000 miles from outside storing in Texas.
Dilemma is that anything can be replaced. Brake discs for instance live about 100.000 miles (plus minus 75.000).
Wear parts inside the engine can suffer from more or less wear due to not enough/incorrect grade/too old oil.
I think that timing chain or sprocket would be good indicators as they have a sort of constant wear, as they are, i think, not influenced by time or lubrication. (perhaps by driving style?)
However that would need a certain aspect to be measured (e.g. depth of the teeth of the sprocket), but it also needs an esthablished relation between miles vs that specific wear mechanism.
Perhaps the best route is to track previous owners. But I understand that it could be difficult as well.
The reason that there is no simple answer: many people wonder the same thing when the buy a second hand car - To date no good (easy) indicator has been identified; thus we have a law in the Netherlands against fiddling with the Odo meter for sales purposes.
Many states here require the odometer reading to be put on the application for a new title when a sale is made leaving a trail of mileage which should show if it's been rolled back. But this won't help for cars that have a long single ownership.
For those states that require an odo reading (my state is one of them), how do you access that "trail of mileage"?
A CarFax is some help, but generally wouldn't apply to a car that is old enough to have a 5 digit odo.
Lots of variables. My GMC Sierra that I've owned since new is 23 years old and has over 225,000 miles on it. But it is always garaged, waxed, maintained. It could pass for a 2 year old low mileage truck...
The opposite is also true (too often).
Perhaps what matters the most is the ownership profile, that is, an estimate of the years each owner had the car for and the miles each drove. If you have that chain of custody through repair receipts and a log book, then mileage can be extrapolated and it is hard to hide odometer replacement and tampering.
For more recent cars I was able to sense when sellers were misrepresenting mileage, for example on a Volvo 240 I could clearly tell it was above 100k miles in spite of the odometer reading...
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And for most of the cars I've owned, they were old enough that the state considered them exempt from the reporting requirement. Their value had basically plateaued so the amount of mileage had a lot less effect on the price than the condition which was the big variable.
Breiti
Well-Known Member
The only truth speaks a full history.
I have almost every TÜV report and a km book where the last owner (46 years long) fill in every fuel stop with odometer.
That is so German, but perfect to confirm the odo.
I habe the same question at my Mercedes from Philadelphia.
All sings proof the 1 extra digit, but the question if it is a 2 or 3 is in mind.
Breiti
I have almost every TÜV report and a km book where the last owner (46 years long) fill in every fuel stop with odometer.
That is so German, but perfect to confirm the odo.
I habe the same question at my Mercedes from Philadelphia.
All sings proof the 1 extra digit, but the question if it is a 2 or 3 is in mind.
Breiti
I am fortunate that I have receipts from new from the first owner, including lease documents when he obtained the coupe as his company car. Regular service and repair receipts that document the mileage very effectively.
Very valid problem.
I was also thinking about that.
In the past the ways to tell about the originality of the mileage was by checking:
- condition of the pedal rubbers wear
- condition of the gear stick surface
- how the steering wheel is loose
- gear stick clearance
- completeness of the trunk equipment (tools, spare wheel tyre ...)
- foam stiffness of the seats
- exhaust system completeness and originality
- how the marks/text/symbols on headlight, wiper switches are worn
For MB is was easier as the shade of the orange speedo's pointers was changing over time, UV and temperature (still US location is an exception).
The way to check it might be to open the speedo and check the shades of the numbers for odometer's cylinders responsible for tens of thousands of miles/kilometers. If for example "9", "8" or "7" it was not exposed on the sunlight at all it should be somehow different than lower number's cylinders.
But the best way is to buy car with fully documented history being documented with invoices, BMW registry etc.
I was also thinking about that.
In the past the ways to tell about the originality of the mileage was by checking:
- condition of the pedal rubbers wear
- condition of the gear stick surface
- how the steering wheel is loose
- gear stick clearance
- completeness of the trunk equipment (tools, spare wheel tyre ...)
- foam stiffness of the seats
- exhaust system completeness and originality
- how the marks/text/symbols on headlight, wiper switches are worn
For MB is was easier as the shade of the orange speedo's pointers was changing over time, UV and temperature (still US location is an exception).
The way to check it might be to open the speedo and check the shades of the numbers for odometer's cylinders responsible for tens of thousands of miles/kilometers. If for example "9", "8" or "7" it was not exposed on the sunlight at all it should be somehow different than lower number's cylinders.
But the best way is to buy car with fully documented history being documented with invoices, BMW registry etc.
I have ignored the 5 digit odometer in all of my 11 Classics. Take a holistic approach and, to paraphrase, follow the advice of your local real estate agent:
Condition, Condition, Condition.
Condition, Condition, Condition.
Honolulu
Well-Known Member
CSteve has it right. I've owned 30 bimmers and to me it's not the mileage, it's whether the sale price is adequately supported by the visual and tactile condition of the car. If something's broke, I accept it and/or I'll fix it, but live with it either way.