Alpina genuine or copies?
- Thread starter Simufly
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Looks like something done at a factory, but note that all other lettering is raised, except the ALPINA...really difficult to cast letters into, rather than raised. Mine are raised. I am not an expert, however...
Simufly
Well-Known Member
yep I am reasonably confident that these are not Genuine Alpinas, there is no "Ronal" on the back and looking carefully at the engraving, the first A is quite different from the last one. Also the end letter the crosspiece of the A is sloping.
Also AFAIK FPS were in the makers of the stock BMW Alpina style wheels, so why have two names on the front face?
Also AFAIK FPS were in the makers of the stock BMW Alpina style wheels, so why have two names on the front face?
I don't know what the scoop is on these but I have found several examples online.
http://www.e9coupe.com/forum/threads/fs-14-alpina-wheels.22515/page-2
http://www.e9coupe.com/forum/threads/fs-14-alpina-wheels.22515/page-2
Simufly
Well-Known Member
Mmm not convinced. Ronal were the makers of the ten hole 14" and all the open lug 16" . FPS made the stock 14" Alpina style" in both ridged and unridged spokes and in 6 and 7 ins width, clearly a much larger and longer production run than the small number of "Ronal Alpinas" Indeed all 14" Alpinas I have seen are made by Ronal, even the NOS available now. Clearly due to the rarity the value of the Ronal versions is much higher than the stock 7" FPS. There is therefore a temptation for a trader to inflate the value to the unsuspecting by engraving Alpina and passing them off. Otherwise I can see no reason for adding Alpina next to FPS.
I think there is something to this that we don't understand. The set in this thread represents the fourth set found in the last year with identical Alpina references. Perhaps there was a short FPS run, who knows. They will never be as valuable if people think they are fake. Personally I think they are real Alpina wheels. I'll find more examples online. The next question is, how many FPS wheels with an Alpina logo do I need to find before it becomes noteworthy?
Interesting. It seems that all suspects have the same slanting crossbar on the final A, and a consistant font...so Mark, you may be right.
Simufly
Well-Known Member
Re Font. Good point. I have both infront of me on the bench ATM. The Ronal version is more elegant, the spokes are slightly finer where they join the rim.I have tried to photo them both.
IMO the Ronal is a nicer looking rim, the FPS is chunkier. I wonder what a concours judge would have to say?
IMO the Ronal is a nicer looking rim, the FPS is chunkier. I wonder what a concours judge would have to say?
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Seems like these are either Alpina, or marketed commercially by someone to be taken as Alpina. Maybe worth an email to Alpina to see if they will confirm or deny (or neither of course)?
I also have both, and agree (just went out to look at both)...
I know what the judge would say to me..."why are you parked on our lawn?"
Good idea, Twistinglane.
I know what the judge would say to me..."why are you parked on our lawn?"
Good idea, Twistinglane.
Simufly
Well-Known Member
Have emailed Alpina in Germany for an answer.
Seems like if they are real then FPS cast them then shipped a batch to Alpina where they engraved their name. Otherwise they would have added their name to the mold like the ronal ones.
One interesting thing that I've noticed. The FPS wheels have a partial Alpina part number on them. When Alpina is stamped on them, they get the full number stamped. Those familiar with Alpina wheels no that most of the part numbers start with "36 10", "36 11", "36 12", etc. Also, the Alpina versions do not have a BMW part number on them.
Well the FPS wheels have this - see no Alpina Logo: (Click on image)
And the FPS "Alpina" wheels have the "36 11", plus a 601 stamp which is the part number for an Alpina 14" wheel.
Here is a 16" closed lug Alpina Wheel, notice the "36 11" prefix:
E39 Alpina Parts list, check out the wheel part numbers towards the last page:
http://www.klinika-bmw.pl/alpina-pdf/katalogi/completecats/engd10bi.pdf
Well the FPS wheels have this - see no Alpina Logo: (Click on image)
And the FPS "Alpina" wheels have the "36 11", plus a 601 stamp which is the part number for an Alpina 14" wheel.
Here is a 16" closed lug Alpina Wheel, notice the "36 11" prefix:
E39 Alpina Parts list, check out the wheel part numbers towards the last page:
http://www.klinika-bmw.pl/alpina-pdf/katalogi/completecats/engd10bi.pdf
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The late model FPS 14x6 CS/CSI wheels also have "36 11" cast in them. these wheels came after the Alpinas.
OKilligan
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Hi all,
Past the Q around in the Swedish e9 community and the answer that came up was that the real CSL rims didn't have the Alpina text in the cast, it was stamped. They believed that that the cast text appeared with the e28 Alpina and possible but not likely with the e12 Alpina. So the stamped text is from the early seventies. And that goes for the 16" as well.
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Past the Q around in the Swedish e9 community and the answer that came up was that the real CSL rims didn't have the Alpina text in the cast, it was stamped. They believed that that the cast text appeared with the e28 Alpina and possible but not likely with the e12 Alpina. So the stamped text is from the early seventies. And that goes for the 16" as well.
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Simufly
Well-Known Member
Intresting, the early 14" CSl Alpina (pre Ronal) rims without the extra five small holes had Alpina cast not engraved on the hub.
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I've seen lots of early Alpina wheels in the flesh, including the three piece racing wheels. Like yours the Alpina logo is always cast as a raised logo. These engraved of stamped logos are definitely an exception.
OKilligan
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Hi again all,
I emailed the Q to Alpina about cast or stamped ALPINA text on the FPS turbine wheels and of course if the stamped ones are fake, I also included the picture from my add that Marcos also added to this tread.
Here is the answer;
Dear Mr. Tornlycke,
Many thanks for your mail and the picture.
Yes, this is the 14" ALPINA wheel (36 11 601). This was suitable for many models:
2500
2800
2800 CS
2,5 CS
2,8 L
3,0 S / Si
3,0 CS / CSi / CSL
3,0 L
3,3 L / Li
E12
E23
E24
E28
Hope this will help.
Best regards,
Christopher M. Kratzer
Export
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
ALPINA Burkard Bovensiepen GmbH + Co. KG
Alpenstraße 35-37
D - 86807 Buchloe
Mail: [email protected]
Fon: +49 8241 / 5005 0
Fax: +49 8241 / 5005 155
www.ALPINA.de / Configurator / Facebook / YouTube / www.ALPINAWEIN.de
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I emailed the Q to Alpina about cast or stamped ALPINA text on the FPS turbine wheels and of course if the stamped ones are fake, I also included the picture from my add that Marcos also added to this tread.
Here is the answer;
Dear Mr. Tornlycke,
Many thanks for your mail and the picture.
Yes, this is the 14" ALPINA wheel (36 11 601). This was suitable for many models:
2500
2800
2800 CS
2,5 CS
2,8 L
3,0 S / Si
3,0 CS / CSi / CSL
3,0 L
3,3 L / Li
E12
E23
E24
E28
Hope this will help.
Best regards,
Christopher M. Kratzer
Export
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
ALPINA Burkard Bovensiepen GmbH + Co. KG
Alpenstraße 35-37
D - 86807 Buchloe
Mail: [email protected]
Fon: +49 8241 / 5005 0
Fax: +49 8241 / 5005 155
www.ALPINA.de / Configurator / Facebook / YouTube / www.ALPINAWEIN.de
Skickat från min iPad med Tapatalk
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Educational thread! It's nice that Alpina can answer questions like this.