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bavbob

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I have a few 1500 mile bike trips under my belt. That said, have others found bike riders to be extremely aggressive and arrogant, taking up entire lanes, disregarding signs/signals?

A few weeks ago in Portland Oregon a 17 yo flew through as stop sign and slammed into my rental. Cost me 900 bucks for his mistake (he and bike are fine). Today some ass in Boston at a 4 way stop went thru the stop sign and screamed at me for not stopping behind the line. He claimed pedestrian status. I told him the front of a car won't care what your status is. Where are their survival instincts? Sorry for the rant!
 
Bob,
I've been riding for many years and have concluded that many riders have the feeling that since they're moving only through their physical efforts, they should be given priority over drivers who have an accelerator and brakes. On the other hand, there are many drivers who don't think cyclists belong on the road.
I've made a concerted effort, whether riding or driving, to just go with it and try not to get upset. If a cyclist hit me and he was at fault, I'd file charges if he refused to pay for damages.
 
In PA bike riders are required to follow the rules of the road. Stop for red lights, stop signs, etc. In all my years I have never seen a single biker even slow down for a light or stop sign if all was clear. And even if it wasn't.

When I was teaching my children to drive I told them if the choice came down to swerving into the oncoming lane and having a headon or wacking the biker three feet inside the side line the choice was obvious.

And yes, I have had the finger, the screams, the foul words. So if they want to argue with a two ton projectile so be it.
 
Although most states require bikers to follow the law and in Oregon they are considered moving vehicles, insurance companies still classify them as pedestrians. So there is no recourse if they hit you, your insurance will still pay for any injury even if they are at fault.
 
bavbob said:
I have a few 1500 mile bike trips under my belt. That said, have others found bike riders to be extremely aggressive and arrogant, taking up entire lanes, disregarding signs/signals?

A few weeks ago in Portland Oregon a 17 yo flew through as stop sign and slammed into my rental. Cost me 900 bucks for his mistake (he and bike are fine). Today some ass in Boston at a 4 way stop went thru the stop sign and screamed at me for not stopping behind the line. He claimed pedestrian status. I told him the front of a car won't care what your status is. Where are their survival instincts? Sorry for the rant!
Click to expand...

Oregon, are you surprised?

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=V3nMnr8ZirI
 
Ahh, of course not. The witnesses screamed at me like i was evil. Worse yet, I am an MD, 30 years experience in a Level 1 trauma center, they would not let me near the kid, but some "touch therapist" came along and was asked to evaluate him. Police officer pulled me aside and said they were all crazy and then clarified and said he was from Eugene and please don't think he is from Portland. I went back to my hotel and watched episodes of Portlandia such as the one you linked with a better understanding.
 
Ski coach said:
Bob,
I've been riding for many years and have concluded that many riders have the feeling that since they're moving only through their physical efforts, they should be given priority over drivers who have an accelerator and brakes. On the other hand, there are many drivers who don't think cyclists belong on the road.
I've made a concerted effort, whether riding or driving, to just go with it and try not to get upset. If a cyclist hit me and he was at fault, I'd file charges if he refused to pay for damages.
Click to expand...

Bob, Chris,

I find Boston drivers and cyclists equally bad but in different ways. The cyclists seem to expect cars to defy Newtonian physics, and the cars seem to think traffic laws only matter if there's a cop behind you (who won't give you a ticket for minor things like running a red, 20 over in a 35mph zone, and passing over the double yellow).

I used to bike A LOT, both as a commuter and racer. And I've been hit by a car, once, because the car came to a stop "over the line." Like so far over the line that the bumper was a few feet into the intersection (and into the space I was occupying). So, I have no sympathy for motorists who come to a stop after they've crossed the crosswalk or stick out into traffic.

Any law that gives cyclists the right to violate general traffic laws (like stop signs) is, in my opinion, stupid. I don't know if you can take legal action against a cyclist that damages your car by running a stop sign, but if there were witnesses or an dash-cam ... I'd file a suit just for the satisfaction of letting the cyclist know they aren't somehow above people who drive cars.

John
 
oneills said:
When I was teaching my children to drive I told them if the choice came down to swerving into the oncoming lane and having a headon or wacking the biker three feet inside the side line the choice was obvious.
Click to expand...

You know there's a 3rd alternative. Slow down and wait till you have a chance to pass the cyclist safetly .... even if it means crossing the double yellow for 50 yards. Here in MA, we have lots and lots of very narrow, twisty country 'lanes' with very limited visibility. Sometimes I'll get stuck behind a group of cyclists that can't ride the line because the the pavement is disintegrating. It might be a little annoying, but I've never had to follow more than a minute before it was safe to cross the double yellow, give them multiple yards of space, and pass safely.

If you are faced with the choice of swerving into oncoming traffic or wacking a cyclist going the same direction as you are and holding his/her position (even if it's 6 feet inside the line) then it's very simple ... you were driving too fast for the roads and visibility or you were distracted and just weren't looking ahead until you had no choice.

John
 
John, let me clarify. I live in historic, bucolic Bucks County PA. Rolling hills resembling the Highlands of England and possibly where you live in MA. And hoards of tourists, bikers and drivers, nine months of the year. I have friends who bike, one professionally. I stay within five miles of the speed limit except on the track.

But I have been in situations where I have come to the crest of a narrow, twisting no-shoulder country road and encountered a bike or bikers directly in front of me. Sometimes they are hugging the right side, sometimes not. On any given Sunday one of them could be my doctor, a friend.

In that moment I have no choice if there is a car heading towards me in the oncoming lane. What would you do?

Steve
 
My issue is simple. Nobody has the right to steal my time without my permission. As you know here is Boston and especially where I live, they often take the entire lane. I have lots of bike experience and I believe that unless I can keep the speed limit, I have an obligation to stay to the right when no bike lane exists. It all comes down to respecting each other and no issues of entitlement.

...And yes, the Boston drivers are horrendous. I have always said turn signals here are only to pass inspection and nothing else. Obviously I am a transplant.
 
I have found that if you live in a state with the boarder of another state within 100 miles the other state where you do not live has the worst drivers. I lived in Pittsburgh for 10 years and the residents swore that Ohio drivers were the worst.

Now I live a mile from the Delaware River, the boarder of NJ and PA. I am sure the NJ drivers are the worst having taken first place from the Ohio numbnuts.

True? Steve
 
How about you sit in the left lane, people line up behind you thinking you are going straight and then the light turns green , you through on your left turn signal......... absolutely clueless. Then there's the classic "you want me to let you in, if I stare straight ahead and make believe I don't see you, then you don't exist. Also as you know, hand held cell phones are not illegal in Ma.. Through that on to clueless.

Sorry off topic which was already off-topic.
 
bavbob said:
My issue is simple. Nobody has the right to steal my time without my permission. As you know here is Boston and especially where I live, they often take the entire lane. I have lots of bike experience and I believe that unless I can keep the speed limit, I have an obligation to stay to the right when no bike lane exists. It all comes down to respecting each other and no issues of entitlement.

...And yes, the Boston drivers are horrendous. I have always said turn signals here are only to pass inspection and nothing else. Obviously I am a transplant.
Click to expand...


Guys,
you both make good points. Sometimes cyclists have a death wish. Sometimes they seem to do all they can to piss off motorists. Some feel it's safer to take the whole lane rather than give a clueless driver the impression that they can just barely squeeze by (forcing the cyclist into the curb, we'd just hop up onto the sidewalk because we're clipped in). Sometimes they're just plain stupid.

Likewise, some motorists are just as stupid.

Ride defensively, courteously, and assume you are invisible.
Drive under the assumption that there's an idiot hidden over every hill and around every curve.

John
 
John, I copied your words of wisdom and gave it to my 17 yo who just got his license. 100% agree. Ideally, a biker spends part of their time driving, seeing both sides and just plain getting the big picture.

There is a lack of instinct to survive these days, pedestrians have it to.
 
I believe a number of pedestrians are killed each year in cities like New York when they step off the curb while texting.
 
In Boston where there are sooo many students, earbuds, texting. I see the "pedestrian or biker vs car" more frequently in the ER than I used to.
 
bavbob said:
In Boston where there are sooo many students, earbuds, texting. I see the "pedestrian or biker vs car" more frequently in the ER than I used to.
Click to expand...

That is the scary part. Earbuds and texting relates to both motorists and bicyclers. A toxic mix. Driving down Rt 128, I have routinely seen a driver swerve into my lane as their head bobs down to read or respond to a text. It is dangerous driving a small car much less a motorcycle or bicycle.

Yes in massachusetts use of turn signals is a sign of weakness.
Obviously the Californian below relocated from Boston area
 
bavbob, if you worked the ER in PA you would see an uptick in head trauma since the Pa Legislature allowed motorcyclists to ride without helmets. What were they thinking?
 
bavbob said:
There is a lack of instinct to survive these days, pedestrians have it to.
Click to expand...

I think it is more than this. I think many of these folks would prefer to do away with cars. They view riding bikes and impeding traffic as a political statement. In DC, where I often must drive, riders often ride in traffic lanes even when there are bicycle lanes. I think these folks would perfectly happy banishing cars from the city.
 
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