CSL in Mille Miglia or 1000 miles in one day

Peder,

I agree 100% with Bengal Taiga (and by extension with your Swiss mecanic).
Using one bottle of 5W20 will tranlate into more blue smoke.
Using 100% of 5W20 can damage your engine very quickly: the oil level will sink faster than you could believe - especially at German Autobahn speeds.
And people driving right behind your car will thank you for greasing their windscreens.
Many M30 engines got destroyed because their owners fed them with modern thin synthetic oils.

I have been using Castrol 10w60 or equivalent Motul 300V thick synthetic oils for more than 10 years without problems, also on race tracks.
There is zero chance that such oils will degrade in normal road driving, unless you did not change you oil in a long long time.

In fact using thick oils is the easiest way to add life to engines starting to show signs of wear.
An engine producing blue smoke on 10w40 may stop smoking completely with xxW50 or xxW60 oils and give you tens of thousands of trouble-free extra kilometers.
Most of the time another instantly noticeable effect will be that the engine runs smoother, even at idle.
 
Peder,

I agree 100% with Bengal Taiga (and by extension with your Swiss mecanic).
Using one bottle of 5W20 will tranlate into more blue smoke.
Using 100% of 5W20 can damage your engine very quickly: the oil level will sink faster than you could believe - especially at German Autobahn speeds.
And people driving right behind your car will thank you for greasing their windscreens.
Many M30 engines got destroyed because their owners fed them with modern thin synthetic oils.

I have been using Castrol 10w60 or equivalent Motul 300V thick synthetic oils for more than 10 years without problems, also on race tracks.
There is zero chance that such oils will degrade in normal road driving, unless you did not change you oil in a long long time.

In fact using thick oils is the easiest way to add life to engines starting to show signs of wear.
An engine producing blue smoke on 10w40 may stop smoking completely with xxW50 or xxW60 oils and give you tens of thousands of trouble-free extra kilometers.
Most of the time another instantly noticeable effect will be that the engine runs smoother, even at idle.
 
Hhhhhmmmmmm.

CSL 1973 said:
Any opinions about this oil: Castrol GTX High Mileage 15W/40: http://www.castrol.com/castrol/productdetailmin.do?categoryId=9014102&contentId=7027414
Cheers
Click to expand...

Reviewing this thread you state your oil pressure fell to 1 bar, you know you need a new oil pump, you will examine the lower end of the engine for wear and you have side draft carburation that performs poorly at lower engine speeds. Perhaps I missed this, but did your engine overheat? Does it smoke (exhaust) or make unusual noises? I ask raise these questions since they may relate to one another. As wisely noted by another poster, side draft carbs can also indirectly dilute the oil and reduce pressure as they have a tendency, when not setup well, to dump more fuel into the engine than gets burned. I also wonder why you are driving the car if you have even an inkling that the heart of the engine is failing or on the verge of failing.

If your oil pump is severely worn or has a bad pressure relief setup, running heavier weight oil probably wouldn't help much to increase pressure, but thinner oil would very likely worsen the condition. In fact, if you know you have oil pressure issues, I would think hard driving would be one of the last things you should undertake. I asked about engine coolant temperatures since if the temp remained fairly normal, your engine could probably tolerate lower oil pressures. Not to overlook oil pressure, but overheating would be the prime indicator of warpage and blown gaskets. Noise, depending upon the type and location relates to both issues.

Regarding the use of a 15W40, I do not see any particular problem if your engine showed signs of normal operation (normal oil pressure and temperature). I believe that BMW even made allowances for lighter weight oils where the car was used in colder climates. Sweden likely qualifies as such; however, sustained high speeds might still favor using the 20W50 weight. I would not rate it as inferior to the 20W50 only because I have no idea what measurements are being applied. The "higher mileage" labeling means very little to me since I have no idea whether the additives actually work to swell seals, whether you have worn seals or if there really is a greater amount of zinc or other anti-wear additives versus other readily available motor oils. Since it is a well known brand, you could do much worse. But, if you have a bum oil pump, changing oil is not a cure but a short term treatment.

Good luck again.


Urban myths :?: The Captain of the Wasa could have avoided disaster by using the appropriate weight synthetic oil. And when off duty, the Swiss guard posted at the Vatican favor synthetic oil for their Vespas. :wink:
 
Hhhhhmmmmmm.

CSL 1973 said:
Any opinions about this oil: Castrol GTX High Mileage 15W/40: http://www.castrol.com/castrol/productdetailmin.do?categoryId=9014102&contentId=7027414
Cheers
Click to expand...

Reviewing this thread you state your oil pressure fell to 1 bar, you know you need a new oil pump, you will examine the lower end of the engine for wear and you have side draft carburation that performs poorly at lower engine speeds. Perhaps I missed this, but did your engine overheat? Does it smoke (exhaust) or make unusual noises? I ask raise these questions since they may relate to one another. As wisely noted by another poster, side draft carbs can also indirectly dilute the oil and reduce pressure as they have a tendency, when not setup well, to dump more fuel into the engine than gets burned. I also wonder why you are driving the car if you have even an inkling that the heart of the engine is failing or on the verge of failing.

If your oil pump is severely worn or has a bad pressure relief setup, running heavier weight oil probably wouldn't help much to increase pressure, but thinner oil would very likely worsen the condition. In fact, if you know you have oil pressure issues, I would think hard driving would be one of the last things you should undertake. I asked about engine coolant temperatures since if the temp remained fairly normal, your engine could probably tolerate lower oil pressures. Not to overlook oil pressure, but overheating would be the prime indicator of warpage and blown gaskets. Noise, depending upon the type and location relates to both issues.

Regarding the use of a 15W40, I do not see any particular problem if your engine showed signs of normal operation (normal oil pressure and temperature). I believe that BMW even made allowances for lighter weight oils where the car was used in colder climates. Sweden likely qualifies as such; however, sustained high speeds might still favor using the 20W50 weight. I would not rate it as inferior to the 20W50 only because I have no idea what measurements are being applied. The "higher mileage" labeling means very little to me since I have no idea whether the additives actually work to swell seals, whether you have worn seals or if there really is a greater amount of zinc or other anti-wear additives versus other readily available motor oils. Since it is a well known brand, you could do much worse. But, if you have a bum oil pump, changing oil is not a cure but a short term treatment.

Good luck again.


Urban myths :?: The Captain of the Wasa could have avoided disaster by using the appropriate weight synthetic oil. And when off duty, the Swiss guard posted at the Vatican favor synthetic oil for their Vespas. :wink:
 
2275xxx said:
Peder,


Many M30 engines got destroyed because their owners fed them with modern thin synthetic oils.

Unfortunately I can confirm that. I decided my car deserved 100% synthetic and all it did was burn it up and do a big end bearing.

I was driving around a race track at the time and oil surge was part of it but everyone who know what they are talking about says you most use mineral oil.

$5k later I have good engine and I'd never put synthetic oil near my car again.

:oops:
Click to expand...
 
2275xxx said:
Peder,


Many M30 engines got destroyed because their owners fed them with modern thin synthetic oils.

Unfortunately I can confirm that. I decided my car deserved 100% synthetic and all it did was burn it up and do a big end bearing.

I was driving around a race track at the time and oil surge was part of it but everyone who know what they are talking about says you most use mineral oil.

$5k later I have good engine and I'd never put synthetic oil near my car again.

:oops:
Click to expand...
 
Dead on Wazza. I will know on Monday what the bottom of the engine looks like, and will of course share this with you all.

But first of all, the engine is still strong, has no oil consumption, makes no noises. The Weber 45s are fine for most people, it´s just me who want them 100% even below 4000 RPM. They are now being cleaned down to the smallest part. The fine tuning will then be carried out under loan on a "rolling road" device.

A new pump will increase the oil pressure, but it has been around 3, or slightly below for at least 2 years. (driving at 3-4000 RPM).

The 5-20W oil was suggested by my very able Swedish mechanic friend. It is hard to explain, but it always works according to him. And it did. I had to question him twice on this, as I thought like all others here that it was the wrong thing to do . A bit like the bumblebee being able to fly I suppose.....

My German mechanic, ex-Alpina, confirmed the mineral 15-40W or 20-50W oil as the only correct one for these M30 engines, old or rebuilt.

I have not yet talked to my Swiss mechanic, equally able on all matters BMWs from the 70s. He races a 2002 turbo. I´ll share with you his defence argument (for the synthetic 10-60W oil).
 
Dead on Wazza. I will know on Monday what the bottom of the engine looks like, and will of course share this with you all.

But first of all, the engine is still strong, has no oil consumption, makes no noises. The Weber 45s are fine for most people, it´s just me who want them 100% even below 4000 RPM. They are now being cleaned down to the smallest part. The fine tuning will then be carried out under loan on a "rolling road" device.

A new pump will increase the oil pressure, but it has been around 3, or slightly below for at least 2 years. (driving at 3-4000 RPM).

The 5-20W oil was suggested by my very able Swedish mechanic friend. It is hard to explain, but it always works according to him. And it did. I had to question him twice on this, as I thought like all others here that it was the wrong thing to do . A bit like the bumblebee being able to fly I suppose.....

My German mechanic, ex-Alpina, confirmed the mineral 15-40W or 20-50W oil as the only correct one for these M30 engines, old or rebuilt.

I have not yet talked to my Swiss mechanic, equally able on all matters BMWs from the 70s. He races a 2002 turbo. I´ll share with you his defence argument (for the synthetic 10-60W oil).
 
Thin oel, How thin?

Wazza said:
2275xxx said:
Many M30 engines got destroyed because their owners fed them with modern thin synthetic oils.
-Unfortunately I can confirm that. I decided my car deserved 100% synthetic and all it did was burn it up and do a big end bearing.
-I was driving around a race track at the time and oil surge was part of it but everyone who know what they are talking about says you most use mineral oil.
-$5k later I have good engine and I'd never put synthetic oil near my car again. :oops:
Click to expand...

You mentioned "modern" and "thin" and "synthetic" with emphasis on the "thin" as the primary cause of the "destruction". Just how thin was the oil? Brand and age of the oil? How long ago did this happen?

Maybe I am mistaken, but the most popular brands of racing oil tend to be straight 50 weight that is heavily laden with antiwear/antifoam properties. Among other reasons for using the thicker weight oil is the greater demands placed on the oil in racing and this probably factors in the greater build tolerances found in older engine designs e.g., the M10/M30. For general purposes, I too, would avoid anything much thinner than the originally recommended 20W50 (conventional OR synthetic). FWIW, I had a neighbor with an early E24, who spent hours adjusting his valves trying to eliminate or reduce valve train clatter on his rebuilt head. He asked to borrow oil from me and reluctantly took 20W50 off my garage floor. He was reluctant because his mechanic told him to use only 10W40 oil. Using the 20W50 the noise disappeared. I do not know if this was a function of higher oil pressure or the heavier oil displaced the greater tolerances in the valve gear.

In North America, the trend has been toward thinner oils. This seems to be due to fuel efficiency issues, and perhaps to a lesser degree, reduced emissions. Because of this, conventional 20W50 is becoming as easy to locate, off-the-shelf, as the once ubiquitous oil filter elements. :cry: Does the names DoDo and Carrier Pigeon ring a bell?
Click to expand...
 
Thin oel, How thin?

Wazza said:
2275xxx said:
Many M30 engines got destroyed because their owners fed them with modern thin synthetic oils.
-Unfortunately I can confirm that. I decided my car deserved 100% synthetic and all it did was burn it up and do a big end bearing.
-I was driving around a race track at the time and oil surge was part of it but everyone who know what they are talking about says you most use mineral oil.
-$5k later I have good engine and I'd never put synthetic oil near my car again. :oops:
Click to expand...

You mentioned "modern" and "thin" and "synthetic" with emphasis on the "thin" as the primary cause of the "destruction". Just how thin was the oil? Brand and age of the oil? How long ago did this happen?

Maybe I am mistaken, but the most popular brands of racing oil tend to be straight 50 weight that is heavily laden with antiwear/antifoam properties. Among other reasons for using the thicker weight oil is the greater demands placed on the oil in racing and this probably factors in the greater build tolerances found in older engine designs e.g., the M10/M30. For general purposes, I too, would avoid anything much thinner than the originally recommended 20W50 (conventional OR synthetic). FWIW, I had a neighbor with an early E24, who spent hours adjusting his valves trying to eliminate or reduce valve train clatter on his rebuilt head. He asked to borrow oil from me and reluctantly took 20W50 off my garage floor. He was reluctant because his mechanic told him to use only 10W40 oil. Using the 20W50 the noise disappeared. I do not know if this was a function of higher oil pressure or the heavier oil displaced the greater tolerances in the valve gear.

In North America, the trend has been toward thinner oils. This seems to be due to fuel efficiency issues, and perhaps to a lesser degree, reduced emissions. Because of this, conventional 20W50 is becoming as easy to locate, off-the-shelf, as the once ubiquitous oil filter elements. :cry: Does the names DoDo and Carrier Pigeon ring a bell?
Click to expand...
 
pmansson said:
The 5-20W oil was suggested by my very able Swedish mechanic friend. It is hard to explain, but it always works according to him. And it did. I had to question him twice on this, as I thought like all others here that it was the wrong thing to do . A bit like the bumblebee being able to fly I suppose.....

My German mechanic, ex-Alpina, confirmed the mineral 15-40W or 20-50W oil as the only correct one for these M30 engines, old or rebuilt.

I have not yet talked to my Swiss mechanic, equally able on all matters BMWs from the 70s. He races a 2002 turbo. I´ll share with you his defence argument (for the synthetic 10-60W oil).
Click to expand...

Three different mechanics, three different opinions. Can they all be correct? Or is it a function of different nationalities/language. :lol:

I can appreciate increased fluidity of a lighter weight oil near the Arctic Circle. I can respect the idea of using a thinner oil to loosen up clogged/sticky hydraulic valve lifters or some other plugged passages. While I understand it gets cold near Zermatt, if you are consistently traveling at 140kph, things tend to warm up. Does your car have an attachment to electronically warm your engine?

My non-expert vote goes to the 10W-60. (I believe the "W" stands for "winter" and not the word "weight." The import is that the 10 is the oil's thickness when cold and the 60 when hot).

Please keep us updated. :wink:
 
pmansson said:
The 5-20W oil was suggested by my very able Swedish mechanic friend. It is hard to explain, but it always works according to him. And it did. I had to question him twice on this, as I thought like all others here that it was the wrong thing to do . A bit like the bumblebee being able to fly I suppose.....

My German mechanic, ex-Alpina, confirmed the mineral 15-40W or 20-50W oil as the only correct one for these M30 engines, old or rebuilt.

I have not yet talked to my Swiss mechanic, equally able on all matters BMWs from the 70s. He races a 2002 turbo. I´ll share with you his defence argument (for the synthetic 10-60W oil).
Click to expand...

Three different mechanics, three different opinions. Can they all be correct? Or is it a function of different nationalities/language. :lol:

I can appreciate increased fluidity of a lighter weight oil near the Arctic Circle. I can respect the idea of using a thinner oil to loosen up clogged/sticky hydraulic valve lifters or some other plugged passages. While I understand it gets cold near Zermatt, if you are consistently traveling at 140kph, things tend to warm up. Does your car have an attachment to electronically warm your engine?

My non-expert vote goes to the 10W-60. (I believe the "W" stands for "winter" and not the word "weight." The import is that the 10 is the oil's thickness when cold and the 60 when hot).

Please keep us updated. :wink:
 
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