Euro 1970 BMW 2800 4-Speed on BAT Granada Red

GolfBavaria

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Reserve not met at $16,500?

BAT and the seller are smoking crack. I paid $11,500 for it in 2013 and didn't have shipping or other costs to consider. Gordon was asking $13,500. It was in -much- better shape then and had better bits and pieces. The paint was in better shape, there weren't rust bubbles, the interior was in better shape, etc, etc.

Failure all around.
AbnMike - I totally disagree. I respect your opinion and what you are saying but it doesn't sound like you did a lot of the restoration work yourself or paid to have it done for that matter. Either way, the market in 2013 is a much different market than now. As you know, cars like these are becoming much more valuable and popular simply because they are a great value play. Then, through in the mix a rare color, (nice color at that) and leather interior with the 2800 high compression motor etc. that price will seem cheap in a couple years. Assuming we don't have a major market crash. I don't know the extent of the rust but it doesn't look terrible and for an almost 50 year old car, in my opinion, it looks great. And to have some front end damage fixed it seems to me they did a pretty good job. Anyhow, be happy you were caretaker all those years you had it, sounds like it was tough to let go. I'm going through the same pains right now on whether to sell or keep. Anyways, all good, you can read what I said on BaT. I am e34nut there from my previous e34 ownership when I first joined BaT. You are going to think I'm smoking crack for what I want for mine but I don't think I'm going the BAT route, partly because of the peanut gallery. I have absolutely nothing to hide, lots of people on here know my car well and even then, I don't think it is the right venue for it.
 

AbnMike

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No I didn't do any restoration - I bought it from Gordon already restored. He valued it at $13,500 after doing the restoration, the interior, the paint, etc. I paid not quite that. I upped it a bit with more detailing and caretaking, fluid changes and whatnot but then sold it when I moved to Montana. I sold it for less than I paid and still sent along the 5 speed, etc.

I get that the market is different and alluded to the fact I sold it in 2013, but I'm still questioning what was done after the wreck. Given the paint and body work that had to be done, ignoring the rust in the doors is inexcusable and, to me personally, speaks to an incomplete job. If that's incomplete what else is missing? There's more rust in the doors than when it was sold, which makes me curious where else it is lurking? If it's been driven around in MD it's in a heavily salted area in winter (not that it's been driven in winter, but I don't know. None of us do).

The current seller says it sold in 2017 (after repairs) for close to $20k. That was clearly an impulse buy by someone with too much money because they quickly sold it due to....no air conditioning in Atlanta? It then sold again to someone in Maryland and then sold again to this current auto broker. You mentioned you think this one is a steal at $16,500 but no others other than that resto-mod have sold anywhere close to it. In fact, having known this car I'd put it more against this one: https://bringatrailer.com/listing/1970-bmw-2800-2/ with a couple thousand thrown on top of it.

I understand you're putting a ton of money in yours but as DailyTurismo advises: let someone else spend their money restoring cars...

I understand interest is rising but it's still a sedan, no sedan ever reaches prices of 2 door coupes. It's still a non-power steering, non-AC car that has been in a wreck and at this point has added 4-5 additional owners since 2013.

I love the car. I wanted the car back, but I also don't think the value has increased as much as was being bid and certainly not as much as the reserve. There are no other 2800s in stock form to even compare that ridiculous reserve price to anywhere.

Maybe in 5-10 years?

Then again I sold a 1995 Land Rover Discovery on BAT for $15,000. There's a reason people list things on BAT - many times the purchase price is a premium over anywhere else because there's a lot of rich people impulse buying during auctions. Not all the time...but then again I sold a 1995 Land Rover Discovery for $15,000. About 10,000 more than they sell anywhere else.
 

AbnMike

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People listen to others who say it was a Hagerty Condition #2 which it is not. It is a nice driver that still needs attention, the bidders on BaT pay over market as they get caught up in the moment.
I agree. No way was it a Condition #2. It was always a very nice driver quality 2800. Nothing more, nothing less. It looks like more because the Grenada red really stands out. But it is a driver quality car. Not a Condition 2 by any stretch of the imagination. Close look at the photos would reveal that.
 

CSteve

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No I didn't do any restoration - I bought it from Gordon already restored. He valued it at $13,500 after doing the restoration, the interior, the paint, etc. I paid not quite that. I upped it a bit with more detailing and caretaking, fluid changes and whatnot but then sold it when I moved to Montana. I sold it for less than I paid and still sent along the 5 speed, etc.

I get that the market is different and alluded to the fact I sold it in 2013, but I'm still questioning what was done after the wreck. Given the paint and body work that had to be done, ignoring the rust in the doors is inexcusable and, to me personally, speaks to an incomplete job. If that's incomplete what else is missing? There's more rust in the doors than when it was sold, which makes me curious where else it is lurking? If it's been driven around in MD it's in a heavily salted area in winter (not that it's been driven in winter, but I don't know. None of us do).

The current seller says it sold in 2017 (after repairs) for close to $20k. That was clearly an impulse buy by someone with too much money because they quickly sold it due to....no air conditioning in Atlanta? It then sold again to someone in Maryland and then sold again to this current auto broker. You mentioned you think this one is a steal at $16,500 but no others other than that resto-mod have sold anywhere close to it. In fact, having known this car I'd put it more against this one: https://bringatrailer.com/listing/1970-bmw-2800-2/ with a couple thousand thrown on top of it.

I understand you're putting a ton of money in yours but as DailyTurismo advises: let someone else spend their money restoring cars...

I understand interest is rising but it's still a sedan, no sedan ever reaches prices of 2 door coupes. It's still a non-power steering, non-AC car that has been in a wreck and at this point has added 4-5 additional owners since 2013.

I love the car. I wanted the car back, but I also don't think the value has increased as much as was being bid and certainly not as much as the reserve. There are no other 2800s in stock form to even compare that ridiculous reserve price to anywhere.

Maybe in 5-10 years?

Then again I sold a 1995 Land Rover Discovery on BAT for $15,000. There's a reason people list things on BAT - many times the purchase price is a premium over anywhere else because there's a lot of rich people impulse buying during auctions. Not all the time...but then again I sold a 1995 Land Rover Discovery for $15,000. About 10,000 more than they sell anywhere else.
 

CSteve

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Wasn't there a 2800 sedan in Derby? or a color close that it that was in mint condition that sold for just south or just north of $30k? If I could have afforded it without selling my coupe I would have bought it in a valve beat.

Steve
 

GolfBavaria

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I hear ya, you know the car well. Totally get the DailyTurismo advise. If this wasn't such a personal thing to me, I never in a million years would have dumped that much money into my car. But it's my hobbie and $10K a year isn't terrible over 4 years I guess. I grew up in a Chamonix and have owned a Golf 2002 so this was like the perfect marriage for me.

I spent half my money on gambling, alcohol and wild women. The other half I wasted. - WC Fields.....right? LOL.

Not sure where you would put it but here is Hagerty valuation guide. https://www.hagerty.com/apps/valuationtools/1970-BMW-2800

Seems somewhat in line, if not unreasonable is my point. Again, to each their own. Good luck finding another one some day. You are in the right spot for a good deal to come along eventually. Good luck my friend, happy trials! - Shane
 

GolfBavaria

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Wasn't there a 2800 sedan in Derby? or a color close that it that was in mint condition that sold for just south or just north of $30k? If I could have afforded it without selling my coupe I would have bought it in a valve beat.

Steve
One of the nicest ones I've ever seen online.... http://classicshowcase.com/gallery/BMW69-713/

Went for big bucks as it should, can't remember exactly, way over $30K I think....$50K-ish maybe, someone better than me can maybe find the selling price.
 

AbnMike

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I hear ya, you know the car well. Totally get the DailyTurismo advise. If this wasn't such a personal thing to me, I never in a million years would have dumped that much money into my car. But it's my hobbie and $10K a year isn't terrible over 4 years I guess. I grew up in a Chamonix and have owned a Golf 2002 so this was like the perfect marriage for me.

I spent half my money on gambling, alcohol and wild women. The other half I wasted. - WC Fields.....right? LOL.

Not sure where you would put it but here is Hagerty valuation guide. https://www.hagerty.com/apps/valuationtools/1970-BMW-2800

Seems somewhat in line, if not unreasonable is my point. Again, to each their own. Good luck finding another one some day. You are in the right spot for a good deal to come along eventually. Good luck my friend, happy trials! - Shane
Thanks. Good luck with yours for sure.

I definitely prefer the 2800/Bavaria to the 2002. But I'm weird that way.

Given what I know when I sold it, and what I can glean from the photos I'd put it at #3 Good. There's some rust, not much but some. The interior has more wear. The original suspension system is "long gone"(Gordon's words) which I would suspect would go to proper valuation (even if shocks and springs are an upgrade). The car has different paint jobs on it (fenders and hood are different than the rest of the car). No original radio. There's problems with door fitment due to new seals as well as the observable hood and trunk fitment, etc. And none of us drove it to really see how it rides after the wreck in 2016.

It's still a great damned car. But to be fair and honest it's definitely a number three and if we are using Hagerty, that's $6,800 +/- for the more rare paint color but different spray times. I have investment in it, I have a wife telling me to buy it. I have history in it (our first date, our first road trip, our first banging in the back seat, etc) so I should have more desire to buy it than someone off the street. But I know the car and it shows really well in photos.

But it ain't a Number 2 quality car. It wasn't Number 2 when Gordon sold it to me and it was in much better shape then and when I sold it.

To put it in perspective with that ultra nice 1969 - you would spend another $30-$40K to bring this car up to that car's quality.

Good discussion.
 

JayWltrs

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Will Gran’s one-owner Bavaria in the most recent BMWCCCA Ultimate Classic might be a $30k red Bavaria. Even though it is a non-period Sierra Red Pearl Metallic, it looks
like a stunner, and the story is great.

I’m amazed at how professional the “newsletter” is and how much time @Dirk and others put into it. Plus you get bonus pics of forum members in the centerfold, including @HB Chris and @OCCoupe in a warm embrace. Subscribe today!
By far my happiest mailbox moments.
 

zinz

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This pretty one only got to $10,500 and didn't make reserve. Owner bought it in 2013 for $13,500.


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Ed
 
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