Sun roof adjustment-clip position

[ES 1800]

'73 3.0CS. I am attempting to adjust my manual sunroof. It's been a long time since I took it apart so my memory needs help.

I have the blue book service manual (page attached), but the front clips don't match those pictured there. Two photos of mine are attached. I suspect the manual that I have was printed in 1969, and a different clip superseded that in the blue book. (And based upon what the rather 'lacking' instructions, I would swear a page was missing if it was not printed with a consecutive number on the reverse side.)

1. Which side is supposed to go up in the clips I have, photo 1 or 2?
2. If it is that facing up in 1, then I am going to need longer screws.
3. Does anyone have a later blue book page corresponding to the one I have with photos showing what I have (and hopefully more complete instructions?)

 

[HB Chris]

That section was updated in June 72 but the first page is same as yours. Page 54-12/2 also shows these pieces and shows how to remove and install sliding roof panel. 54-12/3 deals with the frame attached to the body and following pages deal with the electric motor, if fitted. I can send you a scan if I have your e-mail.

Chris

Correction: 8/69 is the current version, not 6/72, I was looking at Section 52.

 

[ES 1800]

Sunroof adjustment-clip position followup

Chris, my email is [email protected]. I have the other pages you describe, but they too show the older style front clips.

The 3rd and 4th instructions on p 54-12/1 are confusing becase:

1. Picture number 3 shows the clip reversed from Picture number 4.
2, What the arrows in either picture refer to is unclear.
3. The 4th instruction says "if the cranked end is mounted on the guide rail, the sliding roof panel will be deeper at the front." Cranked end??? Is this a translation from German issue?
4. It is unclear what instruction # 3 aqnd # 4 have to do with one another.

More complete story: I replaced the cables with Volvo cables as suggested elsewhere in the forum. Getting the REAR guides in exactly the right position is a bit of a challenge too. I am having an issue getting the front end to be ~1 mm lower than the surface of the roof, and having an issue getting the rear end to come up to level, much less 1 mm higher than the surface of the roof.

Using 2 on p. 54-12/1 as a reference, I suspect that the rear guide is a little too far back, because the splined 'finger" on "1" of the illustration is not directly beneath its bracket (the one that attaches to the sunroof), but rather is off at an angle on my car, point at about a 45 degree angle toward the front when I have the sunroof closed. Somehow that rear piece is the part that lifts the rear of the roof up when it's completely closed.

 

[HB Chris]

I think it means Pic 4 is the wrong way to install it. Sorry I couldn't be of more help, I don't have a sunroof.

 

[pamp]

My experience is with the electric roof....I will assume the guides and most pieces are possibly the same just opposite....cable guides to the front for instance....no hands on for the manual. I have referred to both the Blue books and the Haynes. Hard to say without being there. Seems to me what lifts the roof at the rear are the pin rollers and the spring steel retainer....I cannot help to think you have something(s) missing....

 

[adawil2002]

'
1. Which side is supposed to go up in the clips I have, photo 1 or 2?

Picture 1 faces down to the interior, see the wear on the clip from the screws. Picture 2 is the top that rests on the two knurled nuts at the front. Turning the knurled nuts adjusts the height of the front of the roof up and down.

As I recall the manual handle has winding stops, your handle may be stopping before the roof is fully closed. Please double check that with the handle removed, it should wind only so far.

CS and 2002 sunroofs are the same mechanically, this link may help http://www.my2002tii.com/spring_2005/sunroof.htm

 

[ES 1800]

Sunroof adjustment-clip position followup

May I ask if you are speaking from experience with the sunroof, or based upon the photos I posted? The marks on the clips (guides) could be a red herring. I suggest this because even with the knurled adjustment shafts screwed all the way 'up' (i.e tightened as much as possible against the surface of the sunroof), when oriented as you suggest (Pic 1) the front of the sunroof is considerably to high, protruding may 5 mm above the roof surface.

I'm aware of the stop on the manual crank, but thank you for pointing that out.

 

[adawil2002]

Experience with '02 sunroofs.
The wide plastic glide should slide on the rail, narrow part below the rail.

Since you tightened both knurled nuts You may need to back off the knurled nut towards the center of the car to lower the front. The sunroof has an arc to it tightening both nuts will make it too high.

Easiest way is to put the bracket on with the phillips head screws loose, or the outer phillips head screw loose. Then back off the inner knurled nut until you are satisfied with the height.

 

[ES 1800]

Sun roof rear guides-more information

Thanks for the comments to date on this issue.

It's now clear which orientation for the front guides is correct. However, turning the knurled knobs down (toward the ****pit) causes the front edge of the sunroof to rise.

The location of the rear guides is critical, so when replacing the cable/guide assembly when BMW's (or Golde's) lousing plastic units with the much more beefy Volvo 240 assembly, getting them in the right spot it tricky. (Hindsight being 20-20 I wish I had marked location of everything before I took the originals out. EVERTHING!)

The reason for this is that the mechanism causing the sunroof's rear edge to rise is associated with the pivot on the rear guide. As the guide moves forward when the front edge of the sunroof hits the front edge of the opening, continued cranking of the handle causes the rear guide to continue to move forward and the pivot turns the finger-like portion into a more upright position. (I still don't know the exact function of the rod that goes about the sunroof spring, but it has something to do with this.)

I am not completely sure what the final orientation should be. I have attached a couple photos showing what is and what it maybe should be, using the old rear guides as models.

In addition, the Volvo 240 assemblies have longer cables that that for the CS. The cables need to be cut. If there are sharp/pointed wrapping wire ends sticking up the cable will bind in its track, so ground the ends round. I am searching for 1/8" dia swagged bullet-shaped cable ends like the originals (also pictured) right now.

I hope this helps others who find themselves doing this. (I am available for hire! LOL)

 

[Wes]

Sun roof rear guides-more information

Thanks for the comments to date on this issue.

It's now clear which orientation for the front guides is correct. However, turning the knurled knobs down (toward the ****pit) causes the front edge of the sunroof to rise.

The location of the rear guides is critical, so when replacing the cable/guide assembly when BMW's (or Golde's) lousing plastic units with the much more beefy Volvo 240 assembly, getting them in the right spot it tricky. (Hindsight being 20-20 I wish I had marked location of everything before I took the originals out. EVERTHING!)

The reason for this is that the mechanism causing the sunroof's rear edge to rise is associated with the pivot on the rear guide. As the guide moves forward when the front edge of the sunroof hits the front edge of the opening, continued cranking of the handle causes the rear guide to continue to move forward and the pivot turns the finger-like portion into a more upright position. (I still don't know the exact function of the rod that goes about the sunroof spring, but it has something to do with this.)

I am not completely sure what the final orientation should be. I have attached a couple photos showing what is and what it maybe should be, using the old rear guides as models.

In addition, the Volvo 240 assemblies have longer cables that that for the CS. The cables need to be cut. If there are sharp/pointed wrapping wire ends sticking up the cable will bind in its track, so ground the ends round. I am searching for 1/8" dia swagged bullet-shaped cable ends like the originals (also pictured) right now.

I hope this helps others who find themselves doing this. (I am available for hire! LOL)

Just reading your old thread on the E9 Forum.
My car has an electric sunroof and a previous owner has replaced the broken plastic BMW fittings with the metal Volvo ones as you did.
The problem is they never managed to get the roof to operate correctly. At present the motor and tracks all work fine but the rear of the roof refuses to pop up to close.
Even maxing out the adjustment on the Volvo mechanism it wont work.

How did you trouble shoot the issue?