E9 Alpina B3 3.0 CSL

[Queralt-Lortzing]

Hi all,

I read from some of you some posts about the B3 Alpina engine and those CSL carb cars that went directly to Buchloe in order to be converted into B2S and B3 specs.

Actually, one of you talked about a B3 3.0 CSL car, VIN 4355030, that was well known in this forum.

Does anybody knows the owner from this car and how to get in touch with him?

Even more, is there any data or calculation about how many B2S or B3 were ever built?

Many thanks in advance.

Jaime QUERALT-LORTZING BECKMANN

 

[Queralt-Lortzing]

Hi again,

come on, guys, nobody may help me in this challenge?

Please, let me know your thoughts, even to say 'there is no data about that' or whatever.

I'm not talking only about data, but any estimate or count you may be done or heard about.

Thanks again in advance.


Jaime QUERALT-LORTZING BECKMANN

 

[Strato102]

I would imagine Mr. Bovensiepen himself would be a good source of hard facts; not easy to extract, I understand.
Please share what you find.
P.S. I gather your B7 is an e24? Please post a picture!!!

 

[deQuincey]

come on, guys, nobody may help me in this challenge?

Jaime QUERALT-LORTZING BECKMANN

....hummmmm,...

 

[NilsH]

According to this:
http://www.lezebre.eu/car/bmw 30 csl/photo gallery/photo gallery bmw 30 csl 4355030.htm

Coupeking restored the car. So give them a call.

 

[Queralt-Lortzing]

Hi NilsH,

I took a look at Lezebre and read that: "Mis-leading information: unlike what is said on e9coupe.com forum, the engine has not been updated by Alpina."

Unfortunatelly, it seems not to be a B3.

 

[Queralt-Lortzing]

@Strato102 find below the picture from my E24 B7 Turbo Coupe #14

 

[Strato102]

Thank you for the picture. Great car. Interesting Alpina logos on the seats.

 

[Queralt-Lortzing]

OK, comming back to the B2S and B3 issue, I even read in this forum that B3 engine was an injection one, but it's not.

B2S were 250 HP engines with three Solex carbs, while B3 engines were only built for export, same specs than B2S, but with three Weber carburetors.

The reason why is because the Weber carbs mounted in the B3 were not allowed by the German TÜV.

 

[Queralt-Lortzing]

Hi all,

well I learned something about Alpina B2S and B3 that I want to share with you and it's about the power:

- B2S with three Solex 45 DDH carbs delivered 245 HP, instead of the 250 HP from the B3 with three Weber 45 DCOE.

Let me put again the question over the table, anybody heard/knows about a BMW Alpina B3 3.0 CSL still alive or have seen any info about Alpina B3 engines everywhere?

I'm pretty sure that you, gurus, may help me, please.

Many thanks in advance.


Jaime QUERALT-LORTZING BECKMANN

 

[2275xxx]

Here is an example of Alpina engine with Webers and 250ps :

Auto Motor Sport 1972-09-02

 

[2275xxx]

Same car in Sport Moteur, October 72.

 

[IMSA-CSL]

This is the early lightweight steering wheel from alpina protoype car.

 

[Markos]

This is the early lightweight steering wheel from alpina protoype car.

Do you have any pics of it in the prototype car? I know you have oodles of Alpina parts. That looks like a personal wheel with a clocked bolt pattern. Does the wheel fit the personal hub to the left of the steering wheel?

 

[IMSA-CSL]

Yes the HUB is the CSL hub. You can see the wheel in the article above (from 2275XXX). It is more lightweight than the prototipo.

Best regards

 

[Markos]

Apologies in advance for the thread hijack and big (but hopefully insightful) photos.

Yes the HUB is the CSL hub. You can see the wheel in the article above (from 2275XXX). It is more lightweight than the prototipo.

Hi Andreas,

I know that you are an Alpina expert and I could learn a lot from you (and hopefully buy some parts someday). With all due respect, I disagree that this is the same wheel.

In my opinion, the prototype wheel is made by Momo. It has a momo bolt pattern and follows the momo form factor. This includes a 70mm bolt pattern. The wheel in the article above has leather spoke wrap on each spoke. Given that there are three visible holes plus a spoke wrap, I suspect that the wheel is quite large, 40cm or more. The final CSL alpina wheel is 38 cm with two visible spokes. The prototype whee is actually visible in the first edition CSL brochure (see attached). I’ve spent a lot of time staring at this wheel.

The hub in the B&W photos as well as the BMW brochure is clearly an early momo 153 hub. I've had numerous carb CSL owners capture the dimensions of their hub and confirmed that it matches my momo 152 hub (same thing, but 2002 pin).

The hub in your picture has identical properties to a personal hub. The unique cone shape and cavities on the mating surface are unique to nardi/personal. The bolt pattern is 74mm, and usually (but not always) clocked 90 degrees from the momo pattern. I own a personal wheel with a hub pattern that is not clocked. The Hubert H. wheel by personal is also uclocked, with a hole at 12pm.

Your wheel pictured has spokes unlike any that I have seen from momo, and no spoke wrap. Particularly, the width at the end of the spoke near the rim is a direct match for a personal wheel (Often incorrectly called a colludo as I was corrected).

So in short, I think you have a modified personal wheel. It doesn’t match the wheel in the photos, nor does the hub. It also doesn’t match Alpina’s early history with Momo. I know that there are exceptions to momo usage including the early four spoke wheel, but the prototype wheel in the photos is unmistakably momo. There are forum members with very early (pre-CSL) momo Alpina wheels, based off of the Le Mans/Monza/Elite blank.

Prototype wheel from article:

First edition CSL brochure:

Your wheel:

Personal wheel:

Personal hub:

 

[Bmachine]

Experts duking it out on obscure steering wheel archeology. Gotta love it! ;-)

 

[Markos]

Experts duking it out on obscure steering wheel archeology. Gotta love it! ;-)

Hey at least we aren’t talking about blue cloths and pink spark plugs.

 

[IMSA-CSL]

The leather of my steering is not the original one. It was upreholstered.

I also bought later the HUB.

ALPINA used steering wheels of personal im BMW 2002 too.

Maybe you are right. By the way I will make some more pictures from other directions.

 

[IMSA-CSL]

My car has this engine from the beginning of 72. But it is a E3.