Now that is about what I am talking :razz:
I figured something was not right about this.
Thanks so much for the info.
I will try this procedure and report back.
7 teeth equates to about 22 degress?
Is my engine really at TDC?
- Thread starter Stevehose
- Start date
Now that is about what I am talking :razz:
I figured something was not right about this.
Thanks so much for the info.
I will try this procedure and report back.
7 teeth equates to about 22 degress?
You got it.
360* divided by 116 teeth
7 teeth is 22 degrees.
360* divided by 116 teeth
7 teeth is 22 degrees.
Boy sfdon you sure nailed this.:grin:
Found TDC on front damper.
Noted rotor was pointing near slash mark on housing.
Started checking flywheel and with a little cleaning with a brass brush I found a mark with OT next to it and then 7 teeth away was another mark with a Z next to it. Both marks were rusty and kind of hard to see.
BTW it is very easy to put the car in 3rd gear and while on the drivers side to sight the timing window to reach down with both hands and grab the tire to move the car forward and backward. You have pretty good control and I didn't have to remove all the spark plugs.
Cleaned both marks well and waiting to dry to put some paint on them.
It sure is nice to be able to tap into the experience of members here.
I knew this was not the normal flywheel and was hoping someone could tell me what was going on.
I also posted this on the First Fives site because I thought there would be a lot of M30 motor guys. Not a single response.
Great thread.
Did/can you use carb cleaner on the flywheel to clean the timing marks before painting them ?
Did/can you use carb cleaner on the flywheel to clean the timing marks before painting them ?
Sure,
I have found brake cleaner to be a better choice.
It evaporates quickly so it won't damage your clutch plate.
I have found brake cleaner to be a better choice.
It evaporates quickly so it won't damage your clutch plate.
this is worrying me,
so, one tooth out and the engine was still running acceptable !
i wonder hiw many of these little issues our cars are carrying
pamp
Well-Known Member
Just as a side note....back in the '70's Chevy built the 350 with a nylon cam gear. I have seen this wear through the nylon and make teeth to the aluminum to the point of being near the size of the crank gear before throwing the chain, acceptable performance prior to. Quite a bit of adjustability to the dizzy on that motor. Just a bit shocking to me to do the tear down and see this.
Yes, and I was wondering tonight as I was working in the engine compartment, how many lost nuts and washers are down in the crevices-where do they hide? Plenty lost from me!
The TDC is a simple check, do it the next time the valve cover is off.
The TDC is a simple check, do it the next time the valve cover is off.
At the risk of cross-posting, do either of you know where I can get the advance curve for an 0 231 184 008 distributor? Its not listed in the blue books. Mine has retard and advance.
I don't, but you can figure it out manually by taking readings while gradually increasing rpm's and plotting it on a graph with advance and retard lines blocked.
Thanks Steve.
The problem is that I suspect my distributor is not applying the correct advance along the RPM range. The idle on my car is crap and I don't know if its the distributor or carbs. Jeremy at Ireland suggests starting by making sure the distributor doesnt need to be recurved, but neither he or Mesa have the curve for this model of distributor and its not in the blue books.
The problem is that I suspect my distributor is not applying the correct advance along the RPM range. The idle on my car is crap and I don't know if its the distributor or carbs. Jeremy at Ireland suggests starting by making sure the distributor doesnt need to be recurved, but neither he or Mesa have the curve for this model of distributor and its not in the blue books.
What condition is the distributor in? I took mine out, disassembled and cleaned it, made sure all parts were in good shape and working (like the advance weights for instance), oiled it, and reassembled.
If it's idling crappy I suspect carbs as long as the initial advance is set correctly, try around 8-10 degrees BTDC at 950 rpm. You can check to see if the distributor is at least advancing by revving it and watching the flywheel with a strobe. If it is, try looking into vacuum leaks, air syncronization, improperly adjusted or opened butterflies and secondary butterflies (i.e. leaking at idle), sticking/maladjusted linkage, chokes not opening all the way etc. Lots more to go wrong at idle with carbs than the dist I think but others may have an opinion.
If it's idling crappy I suspect carbs as long as the initial advance is set correctly, try around 8-10 degrees BTDC at 950 rpm. You can check to see if the distributor is at least advancing by revving it and watching the flywheel with a strobe. If it is, try looking into vacuum leaks, air syncronization, improperly adjusted or opened butterflies and secondary butterflies (i.e. leaking at idle), sticking/maladjusted linkage, chokes not opening all the way etc. Lots more to go wrong at idle with carbs than the dist I think but others may have an opinion.
I can't find any air leaks. Using carb cleaner I've sprayed the manifold/head area, manifold/ carb and all around the carbs and under the manifold. I plugged the old EGR ports under the manifold with a cool plug from Carl Nelson. No leak that I can find. The carbs are synched, chokes fully open. Adv vacuum from the carb, retard off at the dizzy and plugged at the manifold. I timed it at 32degrees at 3500 RPM. It's fine above 2000 RPM, but below that it struggles and sometimes diesels when I shut it off. The folks at Ireland suspect the springs in the distributor, but I sure wish I had a proper curve to compare to. I suspect user error by me, just not sure where.
Is your distributor working, do you see the flywheel appear to move (with the strobe on it) when you rev it off idle?
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Mike Goble
Well-Known Member
My flywheel is most definitely moving when my engine is running. Rather than looking through some small portal to some mark that is hard to see, put a timing mark on the front of your engine where it is easily seen. Like this:
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checked !
wunderbar ! perfekt ! everything aligned
hi steve, check this, i find a difference in your setup:
i checked a couple more things that were giving me nightmares, like the alignment of the oil holes to the camshafts in the oiling bar inside the head, and just by the case i changed the spark plugs only to find they were in perfect working condition, nice and clean electrode, white ceramic collar and no carbon deposits
you might think that is useless to check a good running car, but one month ago i checked the points gap and i found it reduced from 0,4mm to only 0,25, so yes, a periodic checking is necessary
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steve
i can see a mistake in the relative positioning of your elements in the rocker shafts,
if you consider one rocker arm, you can see the spring on one side, then the rocker arm, then the washer, and then the thick ring
but the right position should be to put the washer between the spring and the rocker arm, this is how the spring works ok, i do not know how critical this can be, but,....please check
you can see how good is to share photos here, you can see differences, and then you can discover problems...
my setup:
your setup:
i can see a mistake in the relative positioning of your elements in the rocker shafts,
if you consider one rocker arm, you can see the spring on one side, then the rocker arm, then the washer, and then the thick ring
but the right position should be to put the washer between the spring and the rocker arm, this is how the spring works ok, i do not know how critical this can be, but,....please check
you can see how good is to share photos here, you can see differences, and then you can discover problems...
my setup:
your setup:
Well that sucks, hopefully it will be ok, if not I will have them redo it correctly at some point, thanks for the keen eye.
Is your distributor working, do you see the flywheel appear to move (with the strobe on it) when you rev it off idle?
Yep, it's working. But I still think something aint right. I just got done checking TDC all around to rule that out:
Flywheel (painting that mark makes all the difference, but I still dont see a ball)
Damper
Cam
I also grabbed a shot of the "Z" mark and raised section on the flywheel while I was there just in case anybody wanted a photo of those.
Z mark
Raised section
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Honolulu
Well-Known Member
David: is that a fraction of the ball, partially hidden behind the casting, in the first picture above?