Reproduction Red handled screw drivers

[David]

Dan,
Do I correctly understand that you will be producing these parts so as to be indistinguishable from the originals which are protected by copyright laws, right down to including the Heyco trademark ?

I work on copyright and trademark issues and I can assure you that if Heyco hasnt given you permission you could be in for a world of hurt. As I said before, I appreciate your involvement with this hobby and I'd hate to see that come to an end due to legal issues.

As an alternative, have you considered asking them to produce an authentic re-issue which you could fund in exchange for sole distribution rights ? That keeps it legal, moral and more valuable to your customers.

 

[ahab]

How are these screwdrivers any different than this?

I just had a new batch of the blue cloths made. They are as original with proper logo. And I also have the valve eccentric adjusting tools, also as original. $40 for the cloth shipped in the USA and $8 for the valve tool shipped in the USA. Or a package deal for both of $45 shipped in the USA.

 

[David]

I'm not sure they are different. When you make a product that looks like it was produced by a brand that has not given you rights to their intellectual property and trademark, it's counterfeit. And if the brand owner wants to make an example out of you, you could be looking at jail time. You don't need to have a big international trafficking operation to get in serious trouble:


A Year in Jail for Bootleg Seller
July 29, 2004 | Chuck Philips, Times Staff Writer
A San Fernando man arrested for selling bootleg movies from the trunk of his car was sentenced Wednesday to a year in county jail in one of the steepest penalties to date in the movie industry's war on piracy. Jose Procopio Aniceto, 35, pleaded guilty to six felony counterfeiting charges after police in May found him selling the DVDs out of his 1996 Buick in the Santee Alley area downtown...

 

[lazytv]

It would be great to have some sort of directory or current listing of all the parts being reproduced by members on this board or perhaps members listing them on 'http://etsy.com' and tagging them 'e9coupe' or some such thing.

Just a thought.

 

[Gernstetter]

I'm not sure they are different. When you make a product that looks like it was produced by a brand that has not given you rights to their intellectual property and trademark, it's counterfeit. And if the brand owner wants to make an example out of you, you could be looking at jail time. You don't need to have a big international trafficking operation to get in serious trouble:


A Year in Jail for Bootleg Seller
July 29, 2004 | Chuck Philips, Times Staff Writer
A San Fernando man arrested for selling bootleg movies from the trunk of his car was sentenced Wednesday to a year in county jail in one of the steepest penalties to date in the movie industry's war on piracy. Jose Procopio Aniceto, 35, pleaded guilty to six felony counterfeiting charges after police in May found him selling the DVDs out of his 1996 Buick in the Santee Alley area downtown...

I would agree with trademark member, the point is to have the repros in the car and put the originals in the safe...god forbid you actually have to use the originals ever....I think everyone would gladly pay 99 for a set without the Heyco name...they still make green ones for BMW? Then you don't want a German company upset, they could tell BMW and make your business a living nightmare, but if you do a lot of business with BMW, perhaps they can reach out to Heyco on your behalf? They may be flattered that someone wants to sell plastic screwdrivers for 99 a set!

 

[Bert Poliakoff]

Just some insight as to the green screwdrivers currently available. The handles are a completely different shape and will not fit the slots in the tool tray. The blade on the large handled screwdriver is the same size but it has a hardened tip and that throws it off as well

 

[rsporsche]

well perhaps that could be something that coupeguy could do ... is to utilize hardened tips ... that would be something that Heyco never did on the red handled screwdrivers - and that would be the distinguishing feature of real vs. recreation.

 

[rsporsche]

i spoke to coupeguy a little while ago and he mentioned that somebody on this forum was going to help him with the plating ... but was having second thoughts. don't know who it was / is as Dan didn't throw anybody under the bus ... but i hope they will reconsider so that this project can become a reality.

 

[Bert Poliakoff]

That is me. Dan and I just got finished communicating and we resolved the few things we had to resolve, favorable to both of us. I am sure he will be moving ahead now

 

[rsporsche]

excellent news guys - glad you guys figured it out - thanks for all you both do for us.

scott

 

[Nicad]

You'd think the supply of Red screwdrivers would outnumber Coupes by 50 or 100 to 1 at this point. Must be a lot of them stuck in people's old tool boxes without a clue to their desirability.

 

[rsporsche]

can't tell you how many i have seen that have been used as chisels or pry bars ... back in the day nobody thought the tools that came in the tool box were any good. the other side is that Porsche also had red handled heyco screwdrivers ... so they have eaten up some of the market.

 

[coupeguy]

Its so hard for me to imagine that anyone would be upset by thirty or forty screwdrivers (the small one will have nothing but made in W. Germany) would upset anybody. Other than owners of originals perhaps.

So lets do this, those of you who would not buy a set unless it did say Heyco let me know that you would not buy them unmarked. I am thinking of offering them along with a decal to put the heyco on yourselves as another option. Most of the red drivers had a silkscreened heyco along with a metric size designation. Perhaps just providing a flat surface and a decal would satisfy all the doom sayers on the board.

Let me know, people.

 

[rsporsche]

Dan,

knowing what i now know ... i have no worries about what you are doing. without going into any specifics, as it is not my place to discuss your business, this reproduction is far different than anybody here has anticipated. since David is well versed in copyright law ... perhaps you might discuss this briefly with him and get a professional opinion.

i would prefer - raised heyco to putting a sticker on. that being said, if neither was an option, a perfect red match - color and transparency would allow the toolbox to look complete for everyday use without loss or damage to an expensive screwdriver

 

[wkohler]

How are these screwdrivers any different than this?

I just had a new batch of the blue cloths made. They are as original with proper logo. And I also have the valve eccentric adjusting tools, also as original. $40 for the cloth shipped in the USA and $8 for the valve tool shipped in the USA. Or a package deal for both of $45 shipped in the USA.

The cloths I've seen aren't exact reproductions of the originals - at least the originals I've got. Basically, if there are enough differences no matter how subtle, it's not a big deal to spot. For instance, Bert's cloths haven't dropped prices of the OE BMW cloths and I haven't seen anyone pass off one of those cloths as original. They only made 1.24 billion red handled screwdrivers. They were used in all of the big kits through 7/83 and in many E28 M5s and E24 M6/M635s. There were a few differences in the run too.

I do like the new blades on the small screwdrivers. They're like a hollow-ground blade on the slotted side. Quite nice.

 

[Bert Poliakoff]

And Chris is correct. Mine have very subtle differences. Chris is the only one who has ever brought this up

Years ago, I wanted to sell some cloths to our friend in La Jolla. He was gun shy as he had repro'd some stuff and BMW came after him He spent a lot of money fighting it and lost.

Recently he must have got over it as he bought some in bulk from me. Sliscovitch does too, so I guess that speaks for the quality of what I have.

My cloths have not devalued originals and I have had people ask me for originals and pay me a good bit more than for my new ones.

 

[David]

Its so hard for me to imagine that anyone would be upset by thirty or forty screwdrivers (the small one will have nothing but made in W. Germany) would upset anybody. Other than owners of originals perhaps.

Then there should be no objection to contacting Heyco, BMW and Porsche to get their feedback. Have you had a chance to reach out to them yet ?

 

[Bert Poliakoff]

Bad, bad idea. i have reached out to Heyco 3-4 times over the last several years to see if they would put the screwdrivers back into production at a guaranteed amount being purchased. I dealt with their London office and was blown off quickly each time, and I must admit in a totally snotty manner

Making 30-40 screwdrivers should just stay right here and not make waves. Someone will end up getting bit in their ass.

Guys , we are all of an age where we should know certain things are best left unsaid

 

[David]

Bad, bad idea. i have reached out to Heyco 3-4 times over the last several years to see if they would put the screwdrivers back into production at a guaranteed amount being purchased. I dealt with their London office and was blown off quickly each time, and I must admit in a totally snotty manner

Making 30-40 screwdrivers should just stay right here and not make waves. Someone will end up getting bit in their ass.

Guys , we are all of an age where we should know certain things are best left unsaid

Your last two posts confirm the point I have been trying to make; this is not legal and the copyright owners are willing to enforce their rights. Why on earth would you risk legal action and serious repercussions over a few plastic screw drivers ? I prefer to think we are all of an age where we honor the law and the rights of others.

 

[Sooner]

Dittto

Total agreement,